dormakaba Aktie

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Half Year 2025-2026 Investor and Analyst Conference Call of dormakaba Holding AG. I am Sandra, the Chorus Call operator. [Operator Instructions]. The conference is being recorded. [Operator Instructions].

I would like to remind you that the conference call does include forward-looking statements, which are subject to risks and uncertainties. Listeners and readers are, therefore, strongly encouraged to refer to the disclaimer included in the presentation.

At this time, it is my pleasure to hand over to Till Reuter, CEO. Please go ahead, sir.

Thank you, and good morning, everybody. It's my pleasure to welcome you to our half year results '25-'26 analyst and investor conference call. Today, I'm joined again by my colleague and CFO, Rene Peter, and we are very happy to share with you our financial results of the first half year of '25-'26. I will start with the key highlights and developments of 2025/'26, and after that, Rene will give you more insights on the financial performance, and then we have enough time for Q&A.

In the first half of '25-'26, we continued to execute on our transformation while delivering adjusted EBITDA margin expansion. Let me point out some of the key highlights. In a challenging environment with uncertainties stemming from trade tariffs and ongoing geopolitical tensions, the company delivered organic net sales growth of plus 2% and adjusted EBITDA margin of 15.6%. We see great project wins in key verticals. We are strong on the partner with distribution, but we see strong wins in key verticals like Airports, Healthcare and Marine. And we are also very happy to announce that our data center sales are gaining momentum, and we'll have more to share with you later.

We delivered CHF 185 million of cost savings from the transformation program, somewhat ahead of plan, exceeding the initial target of CHF 170 million. Our M&A got traction. We have -- bolt-on acquisitions are gathering pace, and we completed 6 transactions since July 2025. Our U.S. growth plan is in execution with first achievements in the hardware and automatics business. I think I will also tell you more about our closing product gaps and also supported by first bolt-on acquisitions like Avant-Garde Systems.

Our outlook for the full year, we reiterate our guidance based on stronger volume growth in the second half, which is expected because of our good order backlog and order book, but also here more details for you later.

We have seen solid order intake for Access Solutions in the first half year, supported by project wins in key verticals. As a result, our order book is 6% up. Just some examples. On Airports, we have project wins around the world. We have major airports secured in Germany, Frankfurt Terminal 3, Munich, Düsseldorf. We have project wins in the U.S. Installation of state-of-the-art unmanned access lanes at Halifax and Fort Worth with some Argus eGates. We have project wins with American Airlines and iD4me. We have Canada upcoming. And then also airport related, we have a topic where we are modernizing the U.K.'s border control system.

On the Healthcare side, we gained market share in Switzerland. And I think here, it's very important. And also if we look about the broader picture, because we could focus on cross-selling and hybrid solutions, which are in the end, the portfolio of access control solutions, key solutions and automatics, where we really can have a full portfolio of products delivering for the hospital. And with this offering, we could secure multiple hospitals.

In the U.S., on AS and Healthcare, we closed the product gap with ICU doors, which are in the end, the emergency room. This has also been closed, and we got good project sales in New York and Texas. We made progress in Marine, a very interesting vertical. Cruise ships, we got some contracts. [indiscernible], Carnival, Disney. And I think that is a good progress on the vertical approach, which is in addition to, in our muscle, our partners business. And I think here it's very important, the more end customers we have, we are happy, and our partners we happy because we can deliver both ways, direct and indirect.

On the Data Center, last but not least, I think it's important to spend a little more time. In Data Centers, we gained momentum. Our exposure is still like smaller with below 1% of group sales. But I think here we see a big opportunity. And also you know that on Airports, we have something like CHF 60 million revenue in Airports here in Data Centers. I think this vertical will be bigger than Airports, and we have here -- I think we have the right ingredients to grow this vertical. We have already seen some project wins in the region just in the U.S. with Equinix, EdgeConneX in Germany, we have the Schwarz Group, and we have also in Middle East with Elysium in Abu Dhabi, seen many projects, and I think we will see more projects.

And what's important? When you look at data centers, everyone talks about data centers. In the German way, it was more like the relations center, which existed for the last 50 years. So we don't only talk about new data centers, but also refurbishment of relations center, which means like there's also a big potential for modernization and retrofit. Currently, we see an installed base of around 12,000 data centers, and many of them, with relations centers, have been there for a long time. And here, we see a rising need for security and technology upgrades. I think that is the driver for refurbishment. And here, we see a good potential, and we'll tell you why in a second.

In addition to the relations center and the older data centers, clearly, we see a big wave, especially from the hyperscalers with double-digit growth. And we see that by 2030, the amount of data centers around the globe will expect to increase to around 16,000, and this will result in a great potential and opportunity for dormakaba.

Why do we believe we have a good offering? Because we have a very complete and comprehensive product portfolio for the data centers to cover all security layers of a data center. From the perimeter and central security with our full-height turnstiles and Argus gates to racks lock produced by TANlock, one of our latest acquisitions, I think we have rack access being a key multiplier and allowing for multiple cross-selling. So I think clearly, the rack closing and the lock on the rack is one of the most important parts for the offering. And you will see that we are really part of the -- have a complete offering very much on the security side of the data center. We will help our customers to secure people flow from street to rack out of one hand, full compliance, allowing to exactly know who was where, for how long, as well as who was in, and higher safety standards in compliance with local regulations and requirements.

On M&A, just we talked about TANlock, but we have done 6 transactions since July '25, still smaller transactions, but I think we are speeding up and want to do more one, but it's very important to have the right balance between organic growth, which is our focus, and that has to be strengthened with additional M&A. TANlock, I talked about bolt-on acquisition, enhances our offering for verticals in data centers and critical infrastructure. You know our skyra approach, which is organically new offering where you can really send the keys to the person doing -- on the service line. I think with skyra, TANlock, we have a good offering. We are also in the U.S. We have something in addition to the TANlock portfolio, which also our competitors do have.

We acquired a minority stake in RealSense, spin-off of Intel, talk about how can we install biometric and eye technologies into our products. We don't want to own 100% of, whatever, a camera company or vision company, but it's important to have this part in our ecosystem that we together with RealSense can work on solutions for our customers. And MetaMatic, which is a service business to capture more market share in Germany. And then Avant-Garde, a bolt-on acquisition in automatics in the U.S. headquartered in Indiana. I think it's important that we have some low double-digit revenue number over Avant-Garde.

It's important for our growth plan in America to have more coverage in the U.S. in our automatics through integration and service. It will strengthen our entrance systems control capabilities and also help us to position in this high-margin business to grow in the vertical like Airports and more important or even same important Data Centers.

Vintech, it's a go-to-market hospitality in Australia, a smaller one. And then lately, yesterday, we were signing our SwiftConnect minority stake, which is one on the technology side once you have clearly one user interface for the customer and then you have an interoperability, means like you can align or you can connect different access solutions and have one user interface for the customer. I think it shows that we are working on the M&A side. And for all these acquisitions, it's important they are bolt-on. They are supporting in the market. They are not increasing complexity too much. And I think that we want to continue to have a good balance between organic growth and further M&A.

Another part which is important in our medium- to long-term strategy is the U.S. growth plan. And we all know that we have leading market positions in Europe. We have good position in Asia. We are a distant #3 in the U.S., and therefore, we focus on this single biggest, most lucrative U.S. market with our growth initiatives. We made some progress here. We see that in hardware and automatics, we are on a good track. We are a little softer on hospitality. We'll talk more about hospitality later, because here we had a refurbishment cycle last year and we see that the volumes are coming back in the second half of the year. But I think here we have kind of a special situation. But on hardware and automatics, we are on track and are doing what we had in our plan.

On the hardware side, we launched new exit devices. We closed portfolio gaps. And I think that's very important to be competitive in the core channels to have a full product road map. We have to have more products coming in March and in the second quarter to further close the gaps we have seen or we have in the U.S., and I think that's one of the key parts working on the portfolio, securing new wins, for example, University of Southern California, where you also need kind of the products. At the same time, working on the efficiency of our distributor program, having the right ownership and having plans to improve efficiencies to grow on the hardware piece, which is close to 50% of the U.S. business in the next years.

On the automatics side, we also had good project wins. I talked about the ICU door is one product already before, but also nice project wins with American Airlines. And Avant-Garde, the acquisition from December, January is helping to have more go-to-market and more reach over integration and service business. Both hardware and automatics are on plan to deliver what we were planning.

Hospitality was lower spending because we had, in the last year, a higher refurbishment cycle. We expect that the refurbishment in the next cycle will start in the second half and therefore, also volume will come back in hospitality.

Multi-housing, we had some good project wins. But if you talk about hardware, automatics, and then ACS, hospitality, we also came up with a new strategy. Besides the existing go-to-market, we are concentrating on our commercial component strategy, as commercial is a CHF 2 billion market, where we today only have CHF 15 million revenue, and we want to grow. And I think our goal is to have a market share of 5% to 10%, which is part of the program to come from CHF 722 million to CHF 1 billion. We're working on unified e-locks, e-key readers, and credentials platform, and having the technical building blocks we have with Farpointe, LEGIC, and TANlock in our hands.

So we're working on it, talking to the customers. I think here, we will have a focused go-to-market to the specs. And I think with maximum leverage and minimal complexity, and also besides hardware and automatics, also the commercial, the component strategy is accelerating, and we will have the IST BEST very soon to further work on the component strategy.

America, now coming to the cost side, we already achieved, delivered CHF 185 million of cost savings. Somewhere ahead of plan, but I think it's important cost savings. We are really on plan, on budget with the cost program. And it's very important, I think, to remind you and all of us, compared to the July '23 baseline on gross margin, we improved 100 basis points. And on the G&A expense, we went down 280 basis points.

What does it mean? I think we have our costs under control. And if you look at the half year, clearly, we are not happy with the volume, which is, on ACS, 0. We have an ACS 2.6 over pricing, and on the KWO, slightly negative. But we lowered our inventory at pretty low volume, same time increased our margin. That means we are very efficient. We're working on the cost side. We are ready to take the volume to, in the end, get the volume into margin. And what you see, the platform gets more efficient and leaner. And I think that is a very good base. And with the stronger order backlog for the second half, we expect to be on the corridor between 3% to 5%. And with this cost basis, we should deliver 16% and above 16% for the full year.

I think what we are doing on the cost program, it's going to -- the program stopped end of this business year, but it's very important that once the cost program stops, we are shifting from a program to a standard efficiency. So we will be becoming part of the normal business. So there's not a program, but there will be cost targets for all functions as part of the ongoing business.

On the cost program, you know that we were starting on operations, HR, IT and finance in '23. The commercial transformation was starting later. And clearly, we are continuing on the program and to have more cost savings in the coming year, until '27, '28, also from commercial, which we will then be part of our ongoing efficiency.

With this one, I will hand over to Rene for more input on the financial performance.

Thank you, Till, and also from my side, a warm welcome to our half year results 2025-'26 analyst and investor conference. As Till mentioned, our results reflect continued strong execution of our transformation program by the dormakaba team, resulting in a further adjusted EBITDA margin improvement.

Let's have a look at our key figures for the first half of 2025-'26. We delivered organic net sales growth of 2.0% and an adjusted EBITDA margin of 15.6%, an improvement of 40 basis points over the last year. Return on capital employed increased to 30.3%. Net profit amounted to CHF 77.4 million. Adjusted operating cash flow margin stood at 4.5%. Our net debt declined versus prior year to CHF 458.1 million.

Let's look at some details starting first with the top line development. Net sales reached CHF 1.3627 billion, facing a challenging economic environment marked by trade tariffs and geopolitical tensions. Organic growth amounted to 2.0%, largely driven by strong pricing of 2.6%. Volume remained stable in Access Solutions, but declined in Key & Wall Solutions and OEM. The appreciation of the Swiss franc against all major currencies led to a negative currency translation effect of minus 5.0%. The total impact from M&A amounted to a minus CHF 13.8 million.

Now let's have a closer look at different businesses. Access Solutions delivered organic net sales growth of 2.6%, led by our European markets and driven by strong pricing of 2.6%. Germany, Switzerland and the U.K. and Ireland all delivered solid volume-driven organic net sales growth in tough markets and against a very strong prior year comparison. Germany grew 4%, supported by airport projects and market share gains in the access hardware solutions area. Switzerland was up 5.3%, leveraging its robust installed base in access control. The U.K. and Ireland saw 4.3% growth, thanks to strong hospitality business. Automatics performed strongly in all 3 markets.

North America saw good organic growth in the hardware and automatics business in the mid- to high single-digit range. However, this was partially offset by lower volume in hospitality. Australia and New Zealand recorded organic net sales decline of minus 0.4%, primarily driven by a downturn in the local residential market, in particular in Victoria. Rest of the World reported good volume growth in North, South and Eastern Europe as well as Middle East and India. China, there we saw a double-digit decline due to weak market demand, similar to Southeast Asia and LatAm where we also saw some decline in organic net sales growth.

Access Solutions achieved an adjusted EBITDA margin of 16%, representing a further increase of 70 basis points. As for KWO, the business segment reported an organic net sales decline of minus 1.4%. Good pricing of plus 2.2% could not offset a volume decrease of minus 3.6%, which resulted from challenging market conditions in the OEM business and project delays in Movable Walls in North America.

Adjusted EBITDA amounted to CHF 211.9 million. Excluding currency translation and divestment impact, adjusted EBITDA improved by CHF 10.5 million. The impact from the negative volume was CHF 0.9 million negative. Price and efficiency gains exceeded inflation, investments and lower absorption due to volume and inventory reduction, resulting in a positive price over cost of CHF 12.3 million. As a result, adjusted EBITDA margin improved by 40 basis points and amounted to 15.6%.

Now let's have a look at our profit and loss statements, and allow me to focus on a few items. Let's start first with the gross margin. Even with softer volume and inventory reduction, we managed to maintain our gross margin level, reflecting strong contribution from our Shape4Growth transformation program. Functional expenses continued to decrease. We saw a solid reduction in general and administration expenses in percent of sales, leveraging our shared service centers for finance and HR.

Sales and marketing is still impacted by commercial transformation costs. We expect to see the full benefit in sales and marketing materializing going forward. Effective tax rate remained broadly stable at 26.5%. Adjusted operating cash flow margin amounted to 4.5%, representing a decline of 290 basis points versus prior year. Changes in other assets and liabilities, particularly relating to withholding taxes and prepayments, negatively impacted adjusted operating cash flow. These effects are expected to reverse in the second half of the financial year.

Capital expenditure increased due to investments in our process harmonization program and factory automation, whereas prior year included CHF 13 million from the sale of real estate in North America. Return on capital employed rose by 40 basis points, driven by higher adjusted EBIT over the last 12 months and stable capital employed. Finally, our balance sheet remains strong. We continue to strengthen our financial profile and further reduced net debt to CHF 458.1 million versus prior year. As a result, our leverage ratio further went down to a healthy 1.0x adjusted EBITDA, particularly driven by improved inventory management. Standard & Poor's assigned dormakaba a BBB investment-grade rating, confirming our strengthened financial profile.

With this, I would like to return back the call to Till.

Thank you, Rene. And now let's conclude with our outlook for '25-'26. What we see is a more challenging economic environment. And I think also like the geopolitical tensions are -- we are surprised nearly every day. And what we see that clearly the overall environment is getting more challenging.

What's good on our side? We are very much local for local. It means like that 60%, as an example, in the U.S. comes from U.S. for U.S. and 85% out of Canada, Mexico. So it means that we have a kind of a good hedge against any tensions, because we have a good position local for local. We have a good order backlog, a good order book. That means like even we see the challenges, we see stronger volume growth for the second half of the year, and based on the order book, but also based on this important project wins, which we talked about in the Airports, Healthcare, Marine and other ones, which we have to execute in the second half of the year.

Therefore, we reiterate our guidance for the full year '25-'26 to have organic net sales growth of 3% to 5%, rather on the lower end of the guidance, and adjusted EBITDA margin above 16%, and adjusted operating cash flow margin of 11.5% to 12.5% for the full year.

With this one, thank you for your attention. Last but not least, I did forget something before your questions are coming, which we are expecting and happy to take the question. But as we did in the last year, we want to do a Capital Markets Day to inform you about our next steps and what we want to do from a topline perspective, region-wise and also from operations side. Happy to invite you to Capital Markets Day '26. I will give you also an update on next for dormakaba. The Capital Markets Day will take place on November 18 in London. More details to follow by Swetlana and us.

And this one, thank you for listening, and we are happy to get your questions.

[Operator Instructions] Our first question comes from George Featherstone from Barclays.

I just wonder, firstly, you're taking a lot of cost out of the business. And as you said, you're ahead of plan. You're also guiding some volume growth in the second half. So how should we think about the level of operating leverage you now expect for the business on that volume growth in the second half, please? That would be the first one.

Thanks a lot, George, for your question. If I understood you correctly, you were raising the question about volume growth in relation to also the operating leverage, which we have in our financials -- in our P&L. As you know, dormakaba is strongly vertically integrated. So therefore, we see, on the one hand, on operating leverage, actually a situation where we see that volume has an impact on our bottom line results. Particularly when we look at the complexity, however, we see not yet on the op side that we are able to really fully translate that into over-proportional improvement on EBITDA. However, when we look now at the second half year, we see very strong order intake. As mentioned by Till, very strong order book, good project pipeline. And therefore, we are confident that we will see a price over cost which will be exceeding what we have seen in the first half year.

Okay. And then just a second one on that pricing point. Your peers are guiding to a little bit lower price than what you're currently achieving. So I just wondered what it is about your business that gives you that entitlement for higher pricing than some of the other market leaders? And then maybe what the outlook there is for price as we go through the rest of 2026 here on a fiscal basis?

As we have in the past guided that our price impact will be in the range of 1.5% to 2%. What you see, 2.6% is actually including surcharges. I mean, if you were to exclude surcharges, we would be in that range of 1.5% to 2%. That's what we're also expecting for the second half year.

And I think, George, in addition to pricing, it's not -- we have a global number, but pricing is very much depending on the region. And we have this kind of a special situation in America, where I think the whole market is working with surcharges, giving pricing to the customers. And I think we see support on the volume side and could on the pricing side be relatively stable.

The next question comes from Martin Flueckiger from Kepler Cheuvreux.

I've got 2. First one is on the realized incremental cost savings of CHF 37 million. Now I'm a little bit confused. I thought I heard Till saying that you were on target with regards to the cost savings, but then we have seen that you've actually outperformed by, what, CHF 15 million or so compared to your CHF 170 million savings target. So I was just wondering whether you could provide some granularity where that CHF 15 million came from. Sorry if I've missed it in your earlier speech, but just wondering here what's exactly going on? And does that mean we're going to see less incremental savings from the other transformation programs? Or is everything else unchanged? That's my first question.

Let me talk on the cost. So yes, the initial program in 2023 was CHF 170 million, which was operations, finance, HR and IT. And then we had an additional CHF 40 million for the commercial side, another CHF 10 million for door closer complexity, adding up to CHF 210 million (sic) [ CHF 220 million ]. And we are fully on plan. I think if you look about where we also said we are doing CHF 170 million for '25-'26 with regard to this number, we are ahead. However, in our program of the CHF 210 million in total or CHF 220 million, we are on plan, and we're going to deliver in the second half and also some of the cost savings in '26-'27. We have CHF 170 million plus CHF 10 million. And we are...

Okay. So basically, you've pre-drawn some of the savings achieved earlier than expected. But the total of CHF 220 million is unchanged?

Actually, Martin, the higher saving realization mainly comes from procurement, where we have actually overperformed over the last 2 years. But there is no impact on the remaining Shape4Growth savings streams.

Okay. That's helpful. And then the second question is on -- I was wondering whether you could provide a trading update for the start of H2. What you have seen in the first 2 months or almost first 2 months with regards to customer sentiment and I guess also with regards to order intake in the first 6, 7, 8 weeks?

I think it is -- we have a call today, so it's in line with our expectations. And I think based on the first half year and also the start of the year, we are confident to reach our guidance.

The next question comes from Martin Hüsler from ZKB.

Yes. Two questions actually. First of all, on acquisitions in the U.S.A. So far, you rather did bolt-ons. My question here is, should we expect bigger acquisitions to follow in order to achieve your ambitious growth path? And maybe with the acquisition of, Avant-Garde, just to help us to understand what a platform or an independent solution provider like Avant-Garde is bringing to dormakaba? Will you replace other products by dormakaba products? Or how will you leverage this platform? That's the first question.

Okay. Thank you, Martin, for the question. And I talked about the U.S., and we have the plan from CHF 722 million to CHF 1 billion. And this we want to reach over organic growth. And I talked about the product portfolio and additional products we're doing in hardware. I talked also about the ICU door and automatics additional products to, in the end, fill our gaps and to work on the gaps. We will introduce more products in the coming months and quarter in the U.S. I think that is one part of it.

Avant-Garde is a good example of a smaller double-digit revenue, which is helping us on the service integration piece. So we are #3 in the U.S. And we have to work on the nationwide coverage and Avant-Garde is clearly someone who is helping us over service, over a new customer and our partners to cover a bigger area of the U.S. And I think there could be 2 or 3 more Avant-Garde style, like a smaller double-digit number of revenue to grow in automatics, which I would like. But I think it's more like it will be not one big solution, it will rather be a couple of smaller acquisitions which we are looking at, to grow in the businesses constantly and consistently.

Besides the hardware and automatics, hospitality, we have a leading position. I talked about the component strategy. I think that is the third pillar of our U.S. growth plan where we want to get out the commercial, again, organically to 5% to 10%. We have the product, but we were selling it only bundled. We are going to unbundle and work over APIs to connect to the big platforms like Lenel, Honeywell, like JCI, and other ones. And I think that's a different go-to-market with a focused approach on the tax, which we have not done in the past, which is a change in go-to-market. And consistent hardware, automatics product portfolio work, smaller bolt-ons plus the hospitality plus components will bring us to the CHF 1 billion. If there would be a big M&A, it will be even bigger.

The next question comes from Patrick Rafaisz from UBS.

Two follow-ups for me. The first on the cost savings. I think it was very clear how we explained the impact so far and what's coming with the commercial and the door closer business. But I was just wondering, what will then, after that, be the next bigger, let's say, complexity reduction opportunities after the door closer has been completed? Have you identified anything? And if yes, what? That's the first question.

I think, Patrick, if you remember, on our investor presentation, we had the 3 layers. One is the pure cost elevate performance. We have the CHF 170 million plus the CHF 40 million plus CHF 10 million. And then the second pillar is the complexity reduction, I'll talk in a minute, and we have growth. Whilst on the cost side, taking people out, working on shared service centers, low cost, which we're going to continue, just to be clear on this one.

Our assembly site in Sofia will be finished in September. So it will start. And we also continue to work on our shared service center in Sofia for, in the end, the white collar work. So I think that's ongoing. But on the topics we have on our list are door closer, if you start with the hardware. The door closer we talked about the CHF 10 million are only one part of the efficiencies. We have CHF 1.2 billion, CHF 1.4 billion of hardware. We look at the door closer first because it's one of the most complex portfolios which were developed out of this, whatever, 3 region strategy, and we have more than 10,000 SKUs. The door closer together has a revenue of CHF 300 million. We only looked at the CHF 100 million first rack-and-pinion.

And in the CHF 100 million, we're going to reduce CHF 10 million. So CHF 1.4 billion, CHF 300 million, CHF 100 million, CHF 10 million savings. Clearly, we looked at the one which looks most efficient, but we will also like expand the cost saving potential on the other door closer ranges. We already start other products on the hardware side. And there's more potential if you see the CHF 1.2 billion, CHF 1.4 billion on hardware. And I think the door closer is only the starting point. Here, we will educate you more in the full year and also on the Capital Markets Day, how much more potential we do have on the hardware side.

The same on the software side. We talked about this complexity of having more than 50 software platforms, which you have to maintain and you have to service. And same what we did on the hardware side, limiting or reducing the number of SKUs, reducing the number of platforms we are working on, and we will free up resources to work even on more top line. So more applications, more requirements. And this both is ongoing. The third part is still our procurement. With a project like door closer complexity, we are further working on our suppliers, having less suppliers, which means like we have more stake, we have better negotiation power. This is ongoing where our ambition on the procurement will be higher in the future.

And then also like on operations footprint, we did one step in '23-'24 on the footprint, and that we will do the next footprint because, I think Rene mentioned, still we worked on the footprint, but still also the complexity, we have some parts we are deeper vertically integrated and see some potential in reducing complexity on the operations side. And I think here, we have still lots of potential. We plan to be at 16%. You know that the competition has a higher number, and we see still lots of potential, not on only taking cost out, but on changing the way we work. And here, I think there's lots of examples where we have more details maybe on the Capital Markets Day.

That's a compelling teaser for the CMD. And then the second question would be on Key & Wall, where volumes were negative and you gave the reasons with the OEM business and the delays in Movable Walls. Can you quantify the dilution from these 2 -- or the growth dilution from these 2 headwinds? And would it be correct to assume that at least for the OEM business, after Q2 calendar '26, this dilution will be phased out, because that's when it started last year?

I think, Patrick, one topic before I hand over to Rene. I think it's very important also to emphasize that on the access, our core business, we are at 16% EBITDA, really improved our EBITDA margin in this business. I think on Movable Walls, we see project delays, which means like good performance. KWO really is still on a high level operationally and margin-wise. And on the OEM side, I think the impact overall like 1% comes from the OEM piece. I think it should level out, should be lower. And I think as mentioned, we have to somewhat get used to it to manage volatility. At least after Q2, it should be leveled out. But still, I think we have a very good MD in China, who is looking for additional business. So I think, yes, we also see opportunities there, not only the risk.

We take now the follow-up question from Martin Hüsler from ZKB.

Yes. A question on items affecting comparability. Can you maybe give us your guidance or expectations for the second half of this year and maybe for next year? And also, I remember that you alluded to shadowing costs, which are not reflected in adjusted EBITDA. Can you give us a ballpark what you think shadowing costs have been in the first half this year in terms of probably basis points on margins?

Thanks a lot, Martin, for this question. So let's start first with items affecting comparability. We reported CHF 28.6 million in the first half year. We're expecting for the full year in the range of CHF 40 million to CHF 50 million, and thereafter, as we already communicated, we will not anymore report on adjusted figures out of the year '25-'26, but for sure, you can expect it will be lower in the coming years.

Regarding work shadowing, the overall impact was about 40 basis points, 10 basis points still from finance and HR, from SG&A side, and 30 basis points from the commercial shared service center setup. On the commercial shared service center setup, you will see still a continuous impact on that, but we will see, now especially in the second half year, the savings coming through based on the first transition to Sofia.

The next question comes from Lars Vom-Cleff from Deutsche Bank.

Two quick questions from my side as well. Would you be able to tell us, with regards to your recent bolt-on acquisitions in the U.S., how much revenue, EBITDA, in absolute terms, that we'll be adding to the group? And are these acquisitions margin enhancing from the beginning onward?

We are not disclosing financial information by transaction. When we look at that acquisition which we did in the U.S., this was more a smaller transaction, except Avant-Garde, where we already mentioned about the low double-digit sales figure. When we look at the 2 acquisitions which we are disclosing now in the financial bridge, this is van den Berg as well As TANlock. TANlock is actually a project business. There, we are building up now the project pipeline. We have already won some major wins with the Schwarz Group in Europe. Here, you have seen the first 6 months was in line with our business plan, still dilutive, but we expect in the next 12 months to see a change in that situation.

Okay. And then you spent some time on your Data Center business and the impressive compound annual growth rate you're expecting. Are you also envisaging to gain market share? Or is that rather a growth in line with the overall market?

No, I think it's market share. We have the -- the strength of dormakaba from the past is the partner model that we have mainly in Europe, strong partners for the last 100 years, and people who are working over generations. We want to keep the partner business for sure, but we are strengthening with our vertical approach that we have, partner verticals like Airports, Hospitals, but also Data Centers, where we have an offering suited for the data centers. And I think as a good example, we have TANlock. So we can offer the customers, like from the entrance to the rack, the seamless integration of all the locks that you can go in. And depending on your, how you call it, freedom to operate or freedom to use part of the building, you are allowed to go in certain areas or not. I think it's something where we have a good offering, which is including lots of security and technical features which we have. And yes, this would be somewhere supporting the organic growth in the regions with our vertical.

And in the end, if you talk about verticals, it's important to talk to the end customer. Sometimes you serve them over a partner, but it's important, too, that people know our offering. And I think what we've seen in many examples. And you saw the hospital in Switzerland where we can sell automatic access solutions and keys. So I think it's always good that you have one way to enter the customer. And once you're in, you can sell the full portfolio. It seems like Data Centers, you might win over TANlock, which I think it's a solution where you can have a lock for the rack. It's not so many. So you're getting in with someone with a special and then you are selling more. And I think that's same for U.S., so to have something which is on the technological side leading, which others do not have. And then you are able to sell more standards, which is our approach.

The next question comes from Delphine Brault from ODDO BHF.

I have 2 and I'll ask them one at a time. First, can you remind us the size of your order book and the visibility it provides? I may have missed it.

I think the order book is something like 6% up.

Yes. But the size of it in months of sales?

Something like CHF 550 million to CHF 600 million.

And second question relates to your EBITDA guidance. Reaching an adjusted EBITDA margin of slightly above 16% would imply an improvement of roughly 80 bps in H2 margin, which is twice what you achieved in H1. So can you split out the main components of this improvement? Will it be only operating leverage?

I think what we have seen in the first half that our volume in Access Solutions is 0. We were growing our price. In KWO, we are slightly negative. And I think if we deliver on our volume in the second half, we are confident, because we worked very much on the operational leverage, we got our costs down, and that means like if we're growing by 1% for the full year to 3% to 5%, the volume will be driving our margin. I think that is the main impact. And that's also why you asked on the order book. So having the higher order book and executing on the order book should deliver our 16% plus for the full year.

The next question comes from Ingo Stössel from UBS.

Just one for me. Can you give us some background to your S&P rating? Other issuers here in Swiss franc often do that before they come in euro or dollar. Are you planning to issue in a different currency anytime soon?

Ingo, thanks a lot for the question. Yes, this is one of the considerations which we have. We want to be ready in case there will be maybe some inorganic growth coming. But we also felt that it is worth to really now get a public rating, which we cannot formally communicate, which is also provided by external source such as Standard & Poor's.

Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question. I would now like to turn the conference back over to Till Reuter for any closing remarks.

Well, thank you for attending. Thank you for listening to our call, for the good questions. And hope to see you soon, latest on the Capital Markets Day, but for sure earlier. Thank you very much, and see you soon.

Ladies and gentlemen, the conference is now over. Thank you for choosing Chorus Call, and thank you for participating in the conference. You may now disconnect your lines. Good bye.

Good morning, everybody, and welcome to our full year conference. It's a pleasure to welcome you in Rümlang in our head office and also via webcast to talk about the full year results of '25-'26. Today, I'm joined by our CFO, René Peter. Very welcome to have you here and to have questions together with you on René and myself. Also, just as you know, two gentlemen in the Steve Bewick and Carsten Franke are also here from the Executive committees, maybe you could also have a question to them if you would like.

Let me start with the highlights and the development of '24-'25. And then after the highlights, René will give more insight into the financial performance. And with this one, I think it's very important. We delivered very strong results and made major progress on our strategy execution. We are well on track to deliver our commitments for '25-'26. I think it's very important that dormakaba -- many of you know dormakaba much longer than me, but I think we are on a journey. And the journey was that we have targets of growing consistently 3% to 5% organically and to come up to a margin which is between 16% and 18%.

And this journey, we are on for some time. Now we come to the year '25-'26, where we want to talk about this target. I think that is -- but the journey is on. And I think we are very well on track, thanks to a strong team, thanks to what we have done. We reached our guidance for this year. Cash flow has been substantially improved. And I think we see that the momentum is continuing '25-'26. And I will come back later on the detailed numbers. I think it's very good that we are on this trajectory. We want to grow further 3% to 5%. We want to reach the first time an EBITDA margin of above 16%. And what you also can see on the page that we talked about the ROCE in the past, you want to have a more like even cleaner figure, which means like the adjusted operating cash flow between 11.5% and 12.5% for the fiscal year, which just started.

With this one -- this page is some when we were started. And I think it very well shows where we are on and what we are doing. On the first side, clearly, elevate performance. It's about the strict execution of our Shape4Growth program. And this year, until '24-'25, we realized like CHF 148 million. To come back and to put in relation, we came up with CHF 170 million, finance, HR, IT operations. Out of the CHF 170 million, we have CHF 148 million realized. We put another CHF 40 million to CHF 50 million on top for the commercial, which will come later, but we are well on track to work on the cost savings and have achieved a lot.

One topic on the cost saving was clearly working on the shared service centers and the best cost countries. Sofia, Nogales, Chennai. And it's important, if you talk about it, but you have to build a strong nucleus. If you have a nucleus, you can shift more people. And I think what we achieved in the last year is really we have now 300 and more people in Sofia, which means like you can hand over more functionalities and -- what we have seen that we are on the shared service on the -- without the commercial, 80% completed and more than 20 countries, the back office already moved to shared service.

Commercial, we launched last year on the Capital Markets Day, another CHF 40 million to CHF 50 million on top. And I think that's also where part is going to the shared service. A big part of the commercial execution comes from Germany, U.S. and we are same like cost saving, go-to-market. But I think all these measures show and the path to the 15.5% EBITDA margin. And what we delivered now year-over-year, half year over half year, I think it's really consistent and to be continued.

Complexity. So cost is one topic, but as you all know, complexity is something which dormakaba is very complex. On the product side, and I think we have to manage complexity on the go-to-market in lots of the processes we have internally. And I think it's an ongoing task to reduce complexity. While on the cost performance, the 80% on the CHF 170 million on the commercial, we maybe are 1 year [indiscernible], we are more because we start later. On the complexity, we are in the middle of it. And I think here it is very important. You will see later. We have a new terminal generation. It's about platforms. So you have many, many products and the question more like how many same parts, components you have to come up to the right number of products. And here's about toolbox strategy, modular strategy. And I think we show later one example of how we want to be more platform on the hardware side, on the software side and also on our firmware side.

Same like divestments. So divestments go-to-market. We have sold South Africa last year -- end of last year. We have done the U.K., the less profitable service in the U.K. The Brazil time and attendance we lately sold, and also the Kuwait go-to-market is about efficiency. We can go via partners. I think it's also where we made big progress and it shows we are continuously checking our total market, our portfolio on the product side but also on the go-to-market side.

Supplier base, big numbers 2 years ago. It's continuing. What does it mean? If you had -- I think there was a number of above 20,000 suppliers. If you have 20,000 suppliers, the amount you buy from each of them is small. If you lower the numbers, the amount is bigger, you have better negotiation power. Continuously working on the number of suppliers gives us more power, gives us more potential for cost savings.

Last one on complexity -- not last, but I think to mention here, door closer complexity. When I arrived, we knew they there close to 10,000 SKUs. And I think we will continuously work on this one as an example where we show that on the CHF 300 million door closer business, we believe that we could have above 20 -- close to CHF 25 million cost savings. We are advancing here. We see the potential. But this takes time because in the end, if you're putting -- if you have this complexity and you want to use to a platform strategy, you have to introduce new products. It comes over time, but at least something which is important. And it goes over product, hardware and software, it goes on a go-to-market and clearly also internally where we have to work on the complexity every day.

Not more important, but for me, which I -- in the end, innovation and growth is something which I really want to drive and which is important. We have already started to do small transactions, so four M&A deals. I think it's important to continue. Our competition is continuously acquiring companies. And I think we have to also be part of the consolidation, and we want to be part of the consolidation. We have to further work on the product portfolio. You saw today our announcement about a new CIO, David Fuller, who is joining us as new Chief Innovation Officer. At same time, I'm very happy that Magín Guardiola, who was doing for 2 years really helped us to put in a global product road map to really get the American, Asia and European business under one structure. He will focus on new projects. And David, his background is much more on the software side, having done robotic AI and software, focusing really on how we go to market on the software side and how further to improve our software offering.

The focused R&D. We talk more about verticals. So we have the indirect business, but the vertical, talk about airports, data centers, it's getting more important. And if you talk about product, think it's always you have to combine it with what is the impact on the customer, what's the customer journey. Here also we have progress and I will show a little bit more.

Today, we're delivering strong numbers. That's the one message. And the second message really, we believe we can do more and we have to do more in the U.S. We have well positioned. We have good positions in Europe, #1, 2 position. We have good opportunity in Asia. I think the benefit or the opportunity is for us really how we can grow in the U.S. and here I will show you more details on how we want to change our go-to-market in some areas and how we want to continue in other areas.

I think that's more like happy to talk more about the U.S. It may be one of the areas we also expect more question. I think it's someone when you are leading in Europe. And if you're this #3 in the U.S., you have to go to U.S. and to get more market share.

Talk about the verticals. So on the one hand, we are strong in distributing of our partners, where it's very important, we have delivery at the same time to talk about the end customers and about the customer journey. We are very well positioned in airports with our automation -- automatic gates and our automation business, we have last year closed more than 80 airport projects. For example, Noida Airport in India and Ireland to three main airports. And also, we have lots of installation, for example, with Air Canada. If you pass on a lounge at the airport in Zurich is a good example where you see our gates and our products in the airport.

Another one was the cooperation with Rohde & Schwarz, the security check, how we do border control and automated personal screening. I think airport, we see as one vertical where we are well positioned and we're in the future. Safety, security will change our habits, how we work at the airport, and we are well positioned to benefit from this change at the airport.

Another vertical where we also had nice projects in Singapore and also here in Switzerland, two projects is the health care area. And we have two children's hospital in Sydney and become one of the supplier of a major purchasing organization in the U.S. So also health care. It's more like touchless. When we think about like -- you think back about corona when you have to think how can I enter buildings? How can I efficiently have a people flow, health care is another vertical where we are very well positioned.

Everybody talks about AI. What does AI need? Data, it needs computing power. Computing power is data center. So everybody today, we discussed about the big 4 in the U.S. We talked about also like we see lots of demand in Asia. So here, we have more than 15 projects again. We can do it directly with the data centers. We can do it indirectly via partners. This is a big vertical. And in the end, what you have, you have different cascading of access. If you really can get at the heart of the data center or in different areas. And here the recent acquisition of TANlock is one way where we can also have the recs locked. So I think here, we have, in the end, strengthened our offering for the data centers, but also for critical infrastructure.

Another vertical where we have a nice project is the sports entertainment. Now we have the -- for the upcoming Africa Cup of Nations, we have a couple of stadiums and also in the Melbourne Olympic Parks. So you see that's -- if you want to go the vertical, it doesn't mean that you only go direct, but I think it's important to have the offering and then the customer can decide if you work directly or via partners, but it's good to have the customer journey and to convince customers to go for dormakaba products.

So I love to get innovation into product, into customer journey. And there's a couple of examples, what has changed and how we can get -- introduce our new products. One is the Quantum Pixel, a new product for hospitality, for hotels. I think here you can see like a minimalistic design. I think it's a very nice design. And I think with design also comes a new feature like Apple Wallet and where we have like a digital wallet, it's important that you have a new experience. I think it shows like for modern hotel management, I think that is the right way to go, and it's we introduced last year.

Second one, I talked about the how to make it more like a modular system, the new terminal generation. In the end, you have different terminals for different application, and you have to find a way how can I get a terminal for various application. And what you see is one topic, but what's behind the whole firmware, the electronics, I think it's important that here behind, we have to be less complex. And I think here with this terminal generation, we reduce the complexity, have less firm variance and are much more efficient in introducing this product.

Third product, I want to show you and you heard before, Skyra. Skyra pays in on security, on critical infrastructure, on the topics we hear every day. And what does it mean, it means like simplifying access for critical infrastructure and utility. So you can send a digital key via cloud to the gentleman or lady doing the service. You need no additional key or device. It's simple programming. It allows very flexible. Think about in the past, people had to maintain infrastructure, their big bundle of keys and they have to think about which key fits. Now sending out you can change the route. You can be very efficiently sending the key on the mobile phone without putting the mobile phone to any device. So I think very flexible. And the first project we were starting is in Australia. We're a big partner. Utilities were also like Steve and I talked to the partner, I think it's a good change. And I think it shows that we are driving our DNA is security, critical infrastructure. I think that's where the DNA of dormakaba really fits into.

Transaction. So shifting gears, Shape4Growth, Shape to Growth. So we mentioned that we want -- we have to be part of the consolidation. We need market share in the U.S. We need technology to have a good go-to-market. So the Van den Berg was a smaller acquisition in February, go-to-market on the airport side. Safetrust is going in the direction of readers. It's secure identity, but I think what's important, the reader where you put your batch or your mobile phone is not only a reader, it's a data collection point. And then the question comes up for the customers, what is the customer journey? Can I do more services? And I think that is where Safetrust, and it's one of the -- it's a minority position, but we are together with Safetrust, we have a good innovation power in the U.S.

Kinlong, joint venture we signed lately in China. I think it pays off to China for China. I think I -- we told you that we -- our philosophy is to be local for local. So we have to win in the U.S. We are local 80% to 90% comes from the U.S. for the U.S. Same in Asia. So I think it's very important that also in Asia, we're doing the same methodology. And here with Kinlong potential, it's a go-to-market in addition to our direct go-to-market and we did this joint venture in April.

The latest acquisition TANlock. TANlock, it helps on the offering in data centers and critical infrastructure that you also have the recs closed and you have the same system and to have more locks in the end, a broader offering for data centers and critical infrastructure. And it shows a little bit like go-to-market. I think it's very important, how can we strengthen the go-to-market. We are very innovative as dormakaba. And I think it's important, what do we need to have additional go-to-market, and I think this is something where you should also expect more. I think we cannot give details, but I think we want to grow, we want to clearly grow in the U.S., and one is organically and the other one is clearly over acquisitions.

Simplification. I think I mentioned this one the four parts we sold. Here it's very important. If we are selling a business, for example, the South African business, and we had the business close to CHF 14 million, CHF 15 million, we continue to do business, and we do not lose top line, it's a different go-to-market. So if you're selling, we don't want to lose the business. We want to continue the business, but with partners. And I think it is important that this one has been very efficient and U.K. René will show you how we will grow in the U.K., in the country, and it shows also the sale of a part of the business does not impact the performance of the business. So with this one, handing over to my colleague and CFO, René for detailed financials.

Thanks a lot, Till. And also from my side, a warm welcome to our full year results 2024-'25 Analyst and Investor Conference. As Till said, a strong financial -- we had a strong financial year 2024-'25, and I'm very pleased to tell you more about this.

Let's have a look at our key figures for the fiscal year 2024-'25. We delivered a good organic net sales growth of 4.1% and an adjusted EBITDA margin of 15.5%, marking now the sixth consecutive semesters of adjusted EBITDA margin improvement. Return on capital employed significantly increased to 30.6%, achieving our midterm targets 1 year ahead of plan. Net profit amounted to CHF 188 million. We delivered free cash flow of CHF 176.9 million and we managed to further reduce our net debt by 21.2% to CHF 358.2 million.

Let's look at some details, starting first with our top line development. Net sales reached CHF 2,870.1 million amid a challenging economic environment marked by trade tariffs as well as geopolitical tension. This amount represents organic net sales growth of 4.1% compared to a previous year's already very strong growth of 4.7%. This growth was driven by strong volume growth of 2.4% and robust pricing of 1.7%. The appreciation of the Swiss franc against all major currencies, except the pound sterling led to a negative currency translation effect of minus 2.3%. The total impact from M&A amounted to minus CHF 14.4 million.

Both business segments, Access Solutions as well as Key & Wall Solutions and OEM contributed to the organic net sales growth. Let's have a look at Access Solutions. Access Solutions delivered organic net sales growth of 4.4%, led by our core markets and driven in -- driven by a strong volume growth of 2.9%. The strong momentum that we have seen in the last -- in the first half of this financial year as well as on the second half of last financial year continued in the second half of this year despite the challenging economic environment. All core markets contributed to the positive organic net sales growth.

Let's focus on some key markets. North America achieved a solid organic net sales growth of 4.2%, driven by several projects in the hospitality and in airport verticals. Germany continued to outperform the market and grew organically by 7.4%. The country reported a strong automatics business and market share gains in Hardware Solutions as a result of dormakaba's comprehensive product portfolio as well as focused go-to-market strategy.

U.K., Ireland continued the great performance of the first half and closed the year with an organic growth of 9.7%. The rest of the world markets in Access Solutions recorded an organic growth of 3.1% with strong growth in India, China, France and other midsized markets in Europe. Access Solutions achieved an adjusted EBITDA margin of 15.7%, representing a further increase of 50 basis points, thanks to a strong adjusted EBITDA improvement in the second half of this financial year. KWO continued its of trajectory of good organic net sales growth and record performance with an adjusted EBITDA margin of 21%. While Movable Walls managed to maintain the strong growth momentum from prior year, OEM was impacted by the drop in demand from North America as a consequence of trade tariffs and economic uncertainties, particularly towards the end of the fiscal year.

Adjusted EBITDA amounted to CHF 445 million in the financial year 2024-'25. Excluding currency translation and divestment impact, adjusted EBITDA improved by CHF 40 million. Volume growth contributed CHF 7.7 million. Price increases and efficiency gains from ongoing transformation program allowed us to more than offset cost inflation, resulting in a positive price over cost of CHF 31.8 million. As a result, adjusted EBITDA margin improved by 80 basis points and amounted to 15.5%, demonstrating a sixth consecutive half year of margin improvement. Our transformation program, as Till mentioned, continued to deliver with total cost savings of CHF 148 million realized so far. CHF 64 million of cost savings were delivered in this financial year.

Now allow me to focus on three items in our income statement. Gross margin first. Excluding restructuring expenses, our gross margin further improved by 30 basis points and amounted to 41.6%, mainly driven by operational efficiency improvement and net procurement savings. Functional expenses as a percentage of net sales improved slightly to 29.2%, still impacted by work shadowing expenses. Net profit, excluding items affecting comparability, net of tax, increased by 5.6%. As mentioned, we have delivered substantial free cash flow in the financial year 2024-'25. Adjusted operating cash flow margin amounted to 11.7%, broadly in line with the previous year. Free cash flow stood at CHF 176.9 million, CHF 20 million below previous year due to higher restructuring expenses paid.

To emphasize an increased focus on cash generation, we introduced the adjusted operating cash flow margin as part of our financial guidance. As highlighted before, we achieved a return on capital employed of 30.6%, 1 year ahead of plan, supported by a further improvement of our adjusted EBIT. We continued to strengthen our financial profile and further reduced our net debt, as mentioned by 21.2%. Net debt amounted to CHF 358.2 million resulting in a debt ratio of 0.8x adjusted EBITDA. The repayment of our CHF 320 million bond expiring in October 2025 is already fully financed.

Sustainability remains a core part of how we operate responsibly, safely and for the long term. We have reduced our injury rate by 33.5%, reaching our targets 2 years ahead of schedule. That's a direct result of our teams prioritizing safety every day. We have cut our CO2 emission by 25% since our baseline year 2019, 2020. This is an important and meaningful step forward as we continue driving towards net 0. We have also reduced landfill waste by more than 50%, which shows real progress in waste reduction as well as circular practices.

Our work is getting recognized. We were named as Financial Times Climate Leader in both years 2024 and 2025. We also have achieved prime status with ISS. And for the first time, we have earned a spot on the CDP's A List for supplier engagement.

To align with the company's strategy and with the goal for a long-term balance of profit distribution to the shareholders and retaining earnings for future growth, a new dividend policy will be proposed to the AGM. Reflecting our strong financial stability and our confidence into future earnings, dormakaba Group intends to gradually increase or at least maintain dividend per share each year. For the financial year 2024-'25, the Board of Directors proposes a dividend of CHF 9.20 per share at the AGM in October. This represents an increase of 15% over the previous year. Additionally, to enhance stock liquidity and to make ownership more accessible to investors as well as employees, a share split with a ratio of 1 to 10 will be proposed at the upcoming AGM.

This concludes the part on financial performance. With this, I hand over back to Till.

Thank you, René. And I think, as mentioned at the beginning clearly, we have a journey which is going to be continued, and we work on our efficiencies, we work on the complexity. Today, I want to give a little bit more insight into our North American growth plan.

We have -- everybody as a legacy tradition, and I think it's very important to get the good part of the legacy and where the opportunity is. And also with the legacy, our transition comes a different positioning globally. I think we all know that in Europe where our home is, we are dormakaba, kabadorma, Swiss, German, we have strong positions in Europe, #1 and 2 positions and also in APAC, in Asia, Australia, we have good position, good opportunities.

What -- if we look on the left side with America, I think everybody knows that in the Americas, we are a #3 player, and we are a distant #3 player. However, the biggest market, the biggest single market the most lucrative market is the U.S. And I think that is one of the topics we have to look in more detail and explain how can we do more? Why are we underrepresented? And I think how can we strengthen and that I want to go in more detail. It's our key strategy. How do we want to strengthen our North American footprint and what are new ways we want to go.

First of all, to give you -- about the size. So the biggest market, the most lucrative, we're talking about a $13 billion market. And our business, hardware, AHS, AS and ACS, you see that 50% comes from the hardware, 25% from automatics, and drive 25% from Access Control solution. Today, we are a distant #3. We did not buy the right company in the past. So our market share is roughly around 5% in some areas. The good thing is we have a good position on the hardware side, and we are strong in hospitality. We are leading in hospitality. I think what we want to do, we go through by vertical by vertical and how we want to more clear and we're going to start with this hardware business.

The hardware is the biggest addressable market, roughly CHF 6.5 billion. It's the product oriented, the door closer, door hardware. So we talk about it's getting more cost efficiency wise and the products are largely sold indirectly. Here, we have a sizable business and we have a strong position in architectural hardware. But we are #3 because we have not invested enough. We have under-invested in the past areas. And we did start already last year to invest in the portfolio. We have some regulatory gaps, for example, the exit devices and also in component feature sets that are specific to the U.S. market. Here, for example, locks, we are going to invest. I think it's very clear that we have product gaps in the portfolio, which we are going to fill. We are in the process. And the second part is the go-to-market. Our sales force has been reorganized in a customer-centric way. So we have, in some areas, really very profitable regions, and we have to focus on the right regions. Think about the go-to-market by region, not America as a whole, but we are looking by the regions where we are good, which metropolitan areas we are with the right distributors on the right track and what we have to change.

We have made progress already here. We see the order backlog with some gaps filled. Order backlog is growing. But we are just beginning at this. And I think here, we know it is an existing market. We have a good offering. We have to add to the offering, and we have to focus the go-to-market.

On the automatics, which is where I believe dormakaba, the hardware is not -- it's more commoditized. The automation is much more like where we differentiate, where we talk about the vertical, where we can talk about how to add AI into functionality. I think here, we have a great offering. And we see significant potential. But the same here, we have some product gaps, which are more on the lower end side. And we have to focus more on verticals.

Airport, where we have good global experience, much more to go to U.S. and data centers and health care. And I think here, it's clearly also kind of a product gap where we're talking to partners, but then the go-to market. Whilst the hardware business indirect, over partners on the automatics, it's much more the value contribution comes over installation and service. So we work on the service network. And also here, we have seen already last year some good development. So we got two major purchasing organizations for hospitals. We have seen two big retailers having more orders. So I think it's very important to have the right go-to-market and to engage with the right partnering.

Next one. The third one is the access control solutions. So hardware, automatics, product gaps and go-to-market concentrate. Access Control solution is a different picture. Here, you see it's still like it's -- the market is more than CHF 3 billion. We are very strong in the hospitality area, where we have a leading position. And here, we clearly further develop in the U.S. but also globally.

In the multi-housing, we have a good offering with partners, where this is something where we will benefit and have seen upside potential. Where we are today not really represented in the commercial area. It's 80%, so it's above CHF 2 billion. And what we are going to change here is, I think, is important to explain. Dormakaba from the history is selling engineered solutions. So the product comes as a bundle, and you only can buy the bundle. What we are going to change is that we have not only the bundle, but also the components. So you can sell locks, you can buy readers, controllers. And I think here, we have one customer, so we have the products. We have to adjust the products slightly for the U.S. market. But there's one customer segment, the PACS, the physical access control systems and the OEM partners, which we are not really serving today. So package solution in the past, now we're going to unbundle, selling components to a new customer group of the PACS, which is different than the past. And I think whilst in hardware, automatics, hospitality, it's about the existing go-to-market with more focus with product depth. Here, it's a new go-to-market to the PACS. And why do I believe that we have the right to win here? Because we have in our portfolio some companies which have not been really aligned on the dormakaba journey.

One is LEGIC, credential company, which is really like credential is one of the key criterias for secure access. Farpointe, the reader company, which is in the end run independent of dormakaba in the past. And here we have a good foundation to build on to if there is a solution or we can only sell locks, where we can only sell readers or controllers. I think here is the potential to really not only talk about you can sell the whole bundle but also going by component.

I think that is somewhere where you have some gaps to address on get the API on the product, but it's very important. We have lots of the components existing, but we are today not selling them as components. And therefore, I think it's to be important, open, interoperable. And I think this component will be a new way, and we believe that is a big potential. And this market is today a CHF 2 billion market. And we want to really win. I think the goal has to be to be 8% to 10%. I think that's the goal for the team to build up something here to be really represent in this market.

If you look at the U.S. total, today, CHF 722 million, and the clear goal must be organic and inorganic to go above CHF 1 billion. You have AHS hardware business with a very existing business, adding product, concentrating on the go-to-market, automatics, enlarging the service, the integration of the partner business, hospitality continue with a strong brand, continue with the market and then having the new component commercial part, which I think adds to today's business.

This one plus the M&A plus acquisitions. We are convinced as a team. We want to go above CHF 1 billion, and it's the biggest market. It's for us important. It will also a little change the way today we are very European-centric. We have to be more in the U.S. Also with David Fuller being the EC. He is a U.S. citizen. So he will be based in the U.S., clearly working with the team here. I think that's really like what we want to do and we want to shift gears to grow in the U.S.

Now clearly, continue what we're doing, Shape4Growth, Shape to Growth, complexity. But looking at the outlook, let me give me some comments. So we are -- the business here is already like 2 months old, 2nd of September. So we expect a robust trading environment despite geopolitical tension, discussion on tariffs, which are staying. So uncertainties, volatility stays. And I think it's very important to -- that we also have seen this in the last half year.

We believe that -- we see that interest in Europe could be lowered. The infrastructure package in Germany, we do not see today, but there should something come hopefully. We see increased activities in the U.S. on the investment side, and we see lots of opportunities to grow. The order backlog to date is unchanged. Good momentum, though the year was starting robustly. And then we will further advance on our commercial transformation and on the complexity reduction and want to accelerate profitable growth. And therefore, we expect for this year to grow organically 3% to 5%. We want to achieve an adjusted EBITDA margin of above 16%. We never did it before. So I think it's very important. The team is fully committed to go this next step. And on the operation cash flow margin, we want to be between 11.5% and 12.5%. I think that's a goal, which it's very important that it's a journey.

You've seen that on the complexity, we have lots of projects running, and it's about working further, continue on the cost efficiencies. It has to be part of our DNA. It's a not a cost program, it's efficiencies, continue to show that we can lower the distance to the -- our competitors globally and in the U.S. Thank you. And for this, I'm happy to take your questions for René and myself.

Thank you very much, Till, Rene. So we'll open the Q&A session right away here. We'll start with the questions from the audience first, just a small instruction from my side. [Operator Instructions] Patrick, I think you've got the first question.

Patrick Rafaisz from UBS. Three questions, if that's possible. First on the guidance, and you described a bit the world, right, for the outlook. But what do you assume in the 3% to 5%, the pricing contribution and the volume contribution to be? And in that context, can you quantify a bit what you mean by robust start, right? Because if you look at H2 on the country level in Access Solutions, most regions actually saw a slowdown in volumes. How did that change now into H1?

Maybe we changed the order of your questions. And René, you want to give more light on the second half year.

So when we look at the business, we saw in the second half year organic net sales growth of 3.1% compared to 5.1% in the first half year. However, you need to consider that we were substantially impacted by the trade tariffs in KWO business. And there, we were growing 7% in the first half year and 0% growth in the second half year due to the OEM business. And on the OEM business, actually one part of the business actually is that we are supplying OEM customer in North America out of China. And you can imagine with the significant tariffs imposed in the China delivery, this business was hit substantially. But it was fully compensated by Modernfold as well as our movable wall business so therefore, there you see 0% growth. But behind that, there were some substantial changes.

When we look at the Access Solutions business, the Access Solutions business is partly an indirect business, hardware business, partly also project business. Therefore, you have some seasonality as well in that business depending on some upgrades, which we are doing, like in hospitality, especially in the second half year and the first half of this financial year, which obviously, after a certain deal of time comes to an end. When we look at the business itself, we have seen actually still a very robust performance in the second half year in Access Solutions with 3.9% growth compared to a demand in prior year comparison of about 5% and 6% growth. Now so therefore, we see that there is still a very strong momentum. When we look at our business development in Access Solutions, but I think we need to anticipate that especially the trade tariff impact on the OEM business will continue in the first half of this financial year. But with this, I would like now to hand over to Till.

I think it was important that once you -- I did the same like you have 5% and coming up to 4%, what does the 3% mean? And Access Solutions business is stable on 4% and the impact came from KWO. I think that's important and that also should explain like that the momentum, the 4% growth, plus/minus, continues. So we don't see the 3%. So I think that's what I mentioned to be clear that we first look at the second half to have a clear understanding how to read it and then to understand that we continue on this trajectory.

And Patrick, you raised also a question about pricing impact. The pricing impact we anticipate a price increase of about 50% due to price, 50% due to volume like we have seen that in this financial year.

Yes. Maybe also the tariff will come in the second. So I think the surcharge topic, maybe you can also address because it's a bit pricing plus surcharge.

Yes. Obviously, the guidance on tariffs is difficult because at the end, nobody knows exactly how this will evolve. We have announced in April pricing as a surcharge, not price increases of between 2% to 10% of our product portfolio. And this will obviously help us in the range of 3% to 5%, maybe bringing us more on the upper part, but that's something we need to see how this evolves over time. But so far, what we have seen is good takeover or acceptance in the market of those surcharges.

And I think just on the tariffs to add, because this question has been raised also in the morning. I think it's still very important that we do local for local. So the impact on the tariff should be controlled. And in the end, with our local-for-local U.S., 80%, 90% local for U.S., same for China. I think the impact should be manageable.

Can I ask about the North America growth plan? You blurred the picture a bit right, but trying to understand the message from the bridge to the CHF 1 billion, was the message that it's about 50-50 organic and M&A-driven?

No, I think we have -- that would be -- I would not do this, but I think we have -- first of all, we want to grow above GDP, and I think we want to do a 2% above GDP in the markets. And when I try to lay it out is we have existing established go-to-market with hardware and where we exactly know the customers, where we have product gaps from the past, which we have to repair, which we have to close. And then it's about in some regions, we are very efficient, and we have to work on the regions which are not so efficient. How can we change the go-to-market, do we need new partners, different partners. While it's an efficiency game for me in the end.

On the automatic, it is much more differentiating product or a service of a direct. We talk to data centers, to airports. I think it's more direct, indirect and you need the right service network, you need people who can install it, who can service. So it's growing. There might be also some smaller partners to buy to really getting in the regions to have the right network because the value-add comes over installation. We know this. Same like we have some product gaps, more on the, how called lower-value products, but we need the full portfolio to deliver to hospitals and so on, known.

Hospitality, strong muscle, good product, well-established brand with our key customers. We continue in the U.S. and globally. Multi-housing, some new players like a Butterfly and so on, which are the user interface for you. And there, we have offerings now where we can include our products below the user interface and have an offering which options to grow. The spot which we are going to change is a commercial offering, a CHF 2 billion market where we today have close to a small double-digit number, 2 billion, I think that is I think our -- what our vision and -- what we want to do is we want to get the right market share. And a little bit like the philosophy being here in Switzerland, lots of solutions are engineered, means solution for a big customer, a great solution, sometimes Germany, I can talk about because I'm German-born, a little complex, and you have one fits all solution. And with this approach, we did not really win in the U.S. And I think what we want to do is, and it's more like the component orientation. So you can sell the whole bundle, but you also have the possibility to sell the reader, controller, the lock, you can also get the full one, but the customer decides.

And we have good components. We have with LEGIC with a credential. We have Farpointe. And I think that we want to go a different go-to-market. So are all the products today ready for this composite? No, but we -- it's not a far away because we have something available today to start. And this business is like a CHF 2 billion market and we want to get the market share of close to 10%. So I think that's one part. And so I think I would believe there should be more organically. However, the inorganic part, we can today not to share too many details because on the one hand, it's a consolidating market, yes, so everybody wants to consolidate globally, 35% are with the big 3. In the U.S., maybe the share is a little bit bigger, but we have to be part of the consolidation, and we have not been in the last -- in the last, whatever -- last half year, we did some smaller ones, but we haven't been really active. So we have to get more active.

There is another question here from Martin. Go ahead, Martin.

Martin Hüsler from Zürcher Kantonalbank. I have two questions, completely different from each other. Maybe first about the new dividend policy. Can you elaborate a bit why the Board came to the conclusion that it needs to be changed and that it's not related to any earnings or cash flow metrics? So that's the first question, maybe one by one.

The situation is that we have, over the last 4 years, substantially improved our balance sheet structure. We have a strong financial stability, while at the same time, over the last few years, we have seen some volatility in our dividend payment. And we wanted to care about our shareholders to give a guidance about what they can expect in the future about future dividend payments. This led to the fact that on the one hand, from a business point of view and you have heard about Till explaining our growth ambition.

And a nice ROCE.

We have strong cash flows, but also we need a strong balance sheet to support the strategic direction on inorganic growth, but at the same time, also, we have a stability in our balance sheet, which allows us to clearly indicate that we plan to gradually increase or maintain our dividend moving forward.

Okay. So then maybe we could say that the dividend is kind of a function of M&A opportunities as well. So first, M&A opportunities, and then...

I think dividend is a reflection of a sound financial management, which we would like to establish for future growth, yes.

I think it's expectation management. We want to pay shareholders dividend which is on the level of CHF 9.20 and should at least be stable or grow. I think that's more like expectation management. I think this is also -- and given our forecast and what we see we believe that we still have enough cash flow for investment.

And then the second question, and yes, you alluded to it, but for me, it was a bit too fast. Can you talk again about the shared service centers, where they are at the moment, I think, a plant in Eastern Europe. Do you also have plans for plants in the other shared service centers? And what about the ramp-up of people? So where we are today and where are we in like 2 to 3 years?

As a key element of the Shape for Growth strategy, the transformation strategy was movement of support functions into best cost countries. And we have established three shared service centers. The biggest one currently in Sofia with close to 400 FTEs. The second one in Nogales, Mexico for the North American market, with roughly about 70 FTEs. And the third one in Chennai, India, for Asia Pacific market with 50 FTEs. Over the last 18 months, we have actually migrated more than 20 countries to those shared service center. And this financial year closing was actually done completely out of those shared service centers for those 20 markets. But it's not only just finance, it's also HR. It's also product development. We have also moved IT function into those shared service centers. In addition, also, we have outsourced as part of business process outsourcing IT support functions as a third-party service provider. So this is a move towards migrating some of the transactional activities into best-cost countries. The same thing happens also on the manufacturing side as we have had the groundbreaking of manufacturing plant in North America in Nogales where we expand our production as well as in Sofia for the European markets.

I think just to add, the shared services also the journey and today, if you have 350 plus and also commercial will add to this one. So I think it's a sizable organization now. And even when you only have 20 or 30 people, it's not getting efficient. I think now we are also at a level in Sofia and Nogales where you see efficiency, people can be shared. So I think it was very important to build up this critical size and to further -- in the end, further move business to the shared service, but also to work on the efficiency in the shared service center.

I see there are also some questions from the web. Let's take some questions from there. Operator, please?

The first question from the phone comes from Rizk Maidi from Jefferies.

Can you hear me?

Yes.

A few questions. Maybe I'll start with North America. Sorry, there's a bit of echo, but I'll go through it. Yes, I think since we're shedding more light on the North American business, I was wondering if you could just share with us what this new growth plan will do to the margin. I think the last time you've given some transparency on this business, I think it was in 2021 when you said that the EBITDA margin was 17%, and you had a plan to increase margins by 45 percentage points there. Just thinking about your new strategy of unbundling added service presence, just perhaps what do you think that will do to the margin? And perhaps if you could just show where the margin is today?

Thanks for the good question, Rizk. I think it's two answers to the question. I think, first of all, we have a margin guidance on the 16% EBITDA, which we want to achieve in the coming year where the impact of the U.S. new components will be -- we will grow organically, hopefully, have some inorganically where we want to achieve the 16 plus. We all know that U.S. is the single biggest and the most lucrative business. So clearly, the U.S. business should be accretive to the margin. But I think it will be too early to give an indication of further guidance because the guidance is above 16%. But clearly, it will be beneficial and accretive. And I think that's also the reason why we have to be strong in the U.S. It will be too early to give another indication. I think it's very consistently delivering step by step and now getting the 16% plus, and then we maybe might have more details once we're getting closer to the CHF 1 billion.

The second one is just on the EBITDA for this year. So if I do my math, basically, there's CHF 20 million left in the CHF 170 million program. So this year -- then you have some proportion of nonreoccurrence of the shared service cost ramp-up that should not come back, I think. And maybe René can confirm whether a CHF 30 million number is the right one here. But if I do my math, I get to easily 16.4%, 16.5% margin, perhaps that basically assumes there's no overpricing or no volume drop through? Just if you could give us a little bit of details on how should we think about the margin?

Rizk, thanks a lot for the question. It's indeed, and we already mentioned that we have some additional cost this year, which is part of the normal operating result for work shadowing, but also product transfer into those best-cost countries. This is in the range of about 50 basis points for the full year of net sales. So therefore, obviously, there is some benefit, which we're expecting, especially now in the next financial year to see in the functional cost development, particularly in finance and HR and product development. Now I do not want to speculate on the exact figure, especially also when it comes to the adjusted EBITDA margin. Our guidance is very clear. We would like to be above 16%. We have never been on 16%, and that's our focus to deliver more than 16% for the next financial year.

I think Rizk, can -- I think we can follow your arguments, and we are on a journey, but it's very important that it is not one bullet in the wall. It's lots of small steps, lots of changes on projects, on go-to-market. So I think it's really like the whole team has delivered a great result for the last year. And it's about like to empower and to really do the next step. And as René mentioned, I think it's very important to get over the hurdle because then it means like also kind of a new time. And I think it's one that important, the legacy tradition. It's important to move on, but not -- first get it done and then we do the next one.

Perfect. And then the very quick last one is on the new dividend policy. And my understanding is the extra retained earnings here, likely to go to M&A, and you clearly stated your ambitions there. Just maybe perhaps you could just go back to the M&A policy. Are you ruling out any big transformational deals? And if you could just highlight a bit on your M&A criteria, just to avoid some of the mistakes that have been made in the past when it comes to M&A?

I think now the -- clearly, you want to look about go-to-market. You have seen that focus has to be on the U.S. So really when we look at U.S. targets, the acquisition should be accretive without the goodwill amortization. I think it's important that we talk about accretive, what we understand on accretive. What we do see the market is not really consolidated. So we see also a smaller acquisition. And I think the opportunity should be that we try to get the smaller on a better price, and also expect that once the target gets bigger that you have the competition from our, I'll call it, feathers in the market, which also will bid on it. So I think it is something where -- we have a couple of topics which we are watching on, but I think it's too early to guide. And as I think here it's accretive, go-to-market, U.S. preferred.

All right. I see there is another question from the web. Operator, let's take this one.

The next question comes from Martin Flueckiger, Kepler Cheuvreux.

I have got three, actually. And I'll take one by one. First one is a bit of a general question, more strategic in -- and I guess more strategic rather than tactical in nature. But anyhow, I was wondering, what do you consider to be the biggest challenges and opportunities ahead in the upcoming financial year in both business segments? That would be my first question.

I think it's a very broad question. A question that we like 1 hour or 2 hours. I think it's the biggest challenge which is...

Just key points.

I think the key point is we have a volatile environment. And we have to stay to be very -- stay on execution to continue on our product delivery, and delivery of the product from operations to the market and to win the customers very operationally. Same time, working on the software offering. I think that is two topics to focus on, but then also delivery performance.

Great. And the next one is, I guess, a question for the CFO. Just the number of smaller transactions you've done, some of them were indicated in terms of size. Some of them weren't. So just for updating spreadsheets here, what kind of divestment effect on sales and adjusted EBITDA we're talking about? And what's the kind of total transaction value we should put into our cash flow models for '25, '26, please?

When we look at the last financial year, we had four smaller transactions. These are -- were mostly bolt-on acquisitions. As from that point of view, there was a low single million amount, which we paid. On the divestment side, you have seen CHF 40.4 million divestment impact net as the bigger one was actually on the -- sorry, CHF 17 million. The biggest one was actually the service business in the U.K. And this will continue up to November, once we have announced it. So therefore, I think with these two parameters, yes, that's what is known today. Obviously, whatever new transaction comes up, it's not yet foreseeable and therefore, I cannot make any comments on the related impact.

Okay. And then with regards to items affecting comparability in '25, '26 and the year beyond that. Just wondering whether you could update your guidance there, please, including goodwill amortization?

The goodwill amortization will be in the range of about CHF 23 million. So therefore similar like we have seen that in this financial year. On ISC, we had this year CHF 44.7 million on EBITDA, and we expect for next year in the range of CHF 30 million to CHF 40 million. They are mainly driven by IT cost for our reside transformation program.

Let's doublecheck whether we have any questions in the room? Yes. Go ahead, please.

[ Ralph Caluori ] from ING Bank. We have heard quite something about, on the one hand side, your local to local approach. On the other hand side, also on the ambitions that you have in the U.S. Now I was wondering whether you could share anything around aside from M&A, but more on the organic side, aside from expected CapEx in the U.S. Will that be a ramp-up locally there? Any projections that you have over that foreseeable horizon? I understood it's more in the Access Solutions and less than the KWO, but then understood KWO basically it stalled growth. If you could shed any light on that CapEx over the coming years?

So maybe first on the KWO, the growth was stalled due to China, not due to North America. So therefore, in North America, we are growing positively. We have a good growth momentum in both businesses in the Key Systems as well as on the Movable business. When it comes to the investments, first of all, obviously, we need to invest on a normal operating business. So therefore, the strong volume growth, which we have seen over the last years, especially in North America led to some bottlenecks in the manufacturing environment, which also now requires some investments into especially machinery and equipment, but this is normally in the normal course of business. There's nothing extraordinary, but there is some additional investments currently going on.

All right. Any further questions here in the room? If not, we are heading towards our operator, once again. I see there is a question from Delphine. Operator, please.

We have a question from Delphine Brault, ODDO BHF.

I have two questions. My first question is a follow-up. You put some emphasis on M&A and also on the North America region. And in parallel, your net-debt-to-EBITDA ratio has significantly improved. So my question is, by how much would you agree to increase your debt leverage ratio as compared to the 0.8 at the end of June? Is the 2.5x still valid?

Yes, the 2.5x is still valid. In the short term, we could go up to 3x adjusted EBITDA.

Okay. And second one, I try -- can you be a bit more specific and comment on the trend in terms of activity in the months of July and August. How does it compare versus your guidance? You are in the middle of the range at the low end, at the high end?

As we are absolutely in line with our guidance. We have seen actually a good start in July, continue to in August with positive growth on the top line. And therefore, we are confident that we will also deliver on the guidance for the full financial year.

All right. Let's see. Any other questions from the room? It doesn't seem to be the case. Then there are a few follow-up questions from the web. Once again, operator, please.

We have a follow-up question from Martin Fluckiger, Kepler Cheuvreux.

Again, financial question. Raw material and component prices, can you talk a little bit about the development over the last financial year, what you're expecting best guess for '25, '26 and also update maybe your expectations with regards to wage inflation this year?

In this financial year, we have seen some, let's say, inflation impact overall on merit as well as on material of about 2% to 3%, higher on merit increases, lower on, let's say, on the material side. For next year, we do not see an easing of the situation. We further anticipate inflation to be in the range of 2% to 3% on raw material, but we see that the merit increase slightly comes down, but still, there is quite a lot of pressure in -- on the salary side, especially in some of the key markets. And therefore, the transfer to shared service center is a key, let's say, instrument and a key driver to address those developments.

There is one more follow-up question from Jefferies, if I'm not mistaken. Operator, please?

Yes, we have a follow-up question from Rizk Maidi, Jefferies.

Yes. Perfect. Two quick ones. Number one is, perhaps can we have a little bit more light on the OEM business? I think Key & Wall division overall was flat in H2, and I think the OEM part is quite small. So I guess the decline there has been quite severe. And this yet, we haven't seen an implementation of tariffs. So I was just wondering why do you explain such a big drop? And number two, how are you going to do to mitigate the performance here? And then secondly, just Till, perhaps if you could just elaborate on the journey long term. Obviously, you have the medium-term financial targets. Maybe if you could look at beyond that, so perhaps reducing the complexity of the business. I think you started with door closer was the -- I'm thinking whether there are other product families within the group where you can do something similar. Anything on elevating the performance of the business sort of further and potentially even improving the working capital management within the group as well?

Let me do it more or less on the finance side. OEM business was impacted by the U.S. tariffs in the second half, where in the past, there was 1 or 2 big customers in the U.S. I think we changed OEM that they are not only offering to the U.S., but also in China, but also to Europe. So it's about like how can I mitigate. I think we all know that it didn't happen overnight. And we also -- we relocated business from China to Mexico already last year in the light of what we see on geopolitical tension. So I think OEM they change the way they work. They had been like a work bench in the past for 2 or 3 OEMs, and now they are much more active in getting business on their work bench, which is very efficient in Taishan. So I believe that our leader in OEM doing a very great job in getting new customers. On the journey, I think I laid out, we have the cost efficiencies where you have the CHF 170 million and then the CHF 40 million plus CHF 10 million, which is CHF 220 million, where on the CHF 170 million, we had CHF 148 million. On the CHF 40 million, the commercial, we are starting, so we are working on it. In addition comes more efficiencies. And one of the first meeting, I was asked about what's about the IT system at dormakaba. So I think that everybody has in mind about like that we have a complex landscape that we had various IT programs in the past. Currently, our program reside is really getting traction, and we believe that over reside, we get lots of efficiencies on how we work and that we -- it's one layer of getting not only cost out, but also efficiency. The door closer complexity is maybe on the numbers much more precise. Door closer complexity in the end stands for the complexity, which we have to, on the one hand, manage, but also we think about how can we reduce complexity or find some ways to be better. So we had 10,000 SKUs for CHF 300 million, and we had looked in details and saw that on the CHF 300 million, we can get -- we were further narrowing it down, but we believe on the CHF 300 million, we could have savings of CHF 20 million to CHF 25 million, maybe even more. There's only CHF 300 million out of CHF 1.4 billion hardware. So be assured that we take this out where we see the biggest potential. But the same we can apply to further product groups. So there is more potential on the complexity reduction. And also remember, we did the same on the hardware also on software side, where we had more than 40 -- close to 50 software platforms reducing it to 12 or 14, which is also going on where we are migrating to this, whatever, top 8 or top 10. I think this shows we are on the door closer, we put a number behind. But then clearly, there is more potential. And I think it's too early to put numbers in. But if you have CHF 300 million out of CHF 1.4 billion, there's more to come. And we have more -- to give you more feedback on this one, but this is when you talk about the journey. So I think that the cost savings, more like what how to get to the bottom line. But also, I think it's important that besides the bottom line and these measures, we have to work on the top line, how to get more business also over new products and acquisitions.

All right. For the last time, I'm going to raise this question. Are there any questions left in the room? If not, then I would say, yes, with this, we're going to close our Q&A session. Thank you very much for your participation, for your questions. Please enjoy the light lunch with us. Just it's going to be served in front of the cafeteria there and use the opportunity, of course, to interact with our management. Thank you very much, guys.

Thank you.

Thank you very much.