City Developments Aktie

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, friends from the media, analysts, bankers, investors and fellow CDL colleagues. My name is Belinda, and I'm the Head of Investor Relations and Corporate Communications at CDL. As we are still within the Chinese New Year celebration period, so I take this opportunity to wish everyone in this room, a happy healthy and prosperous year ahead. [Foreign Language] So on behalf of the CDL management, welcome to CDL's briefing on its unaudited financial results for the full year ended 31st December 2025. Now this is a hybrid briefing format with both in person here at the M Hotel Singapore and those joining us live on webcast. and joining us virtually. So thank you all for being here with us this morning.

For today's briefing, in line with CDL's environmental sustainability conviction, we will not be providing printed materials. Instead please scan the QR code on the screen to download or view the following documents that were uploaded to SGXNET as well as our website before trading this morning. Now on this website, you will find a copy of the detailed financial statement. A press release summarizing the key highlights of our FY 2025 performance presentation deck that the management team will be using in a very short well. So for all our guests joining us live on webcast, you will similarly be able to download these documents, which are available on CDL website. I would like to introduce to you our CDL management panel. In the center, we have our Executive Chairman, Mr. Kwek Leng Beng. On his right, we have Mr. Sherman Kwek, our Group CEO, on Chairman's left is Mr. Kwek Sheng, our Group Chief Operating Officer; and on his left, Mr. Chia Yang Hong, our Group General Manager; and nearest to me, Ms. Yang Yin Ming, Group Chief Financial Officer. Now the format of today's briefing will be in 2 parts. We will kick off with a presentation of some of the key highlights of our performance followed later by a Q&A session with our panelists. So without further ado, I would like to invite Mr. Sherman Kwek, our Group CEO, to kick start the presentation. Sherman, please.

Good morning, everyone. Good to see you here again. It feels like the last analyst briefing was a long time ago, but really it's every 6 months, and happy to be here, albeit every year I see you, I have less hair but good to see you all. And this year, obviously, we're going to have a more positive and upbeat results to report. So we started off with a slide that shows you, I think, the key achievements that we did last year as we committed to everyone we were going to accelerate our capital recycling -- and we're happy to announce that we have achieved $2 billion in divestments -- and we were very selective in our acquisitions. So really, what we invested were in 3 GLS sites in Singapore as well as a hotel in London, in Kensington.

And at the same time, I mean, you can see that last year was a very strong year for us in the Singapore local market. In terms of residential sales value, we achieved $4.35 billion, which is the highest in our group 63-year history. So we're really pleased with that. The 1.657 number includes ECs as well. So if we use the corresponding number released by the URA, including ECs, it's about a 13% market share, shall be higher if we excluded ECs because last year, we sold more non-ECs and last year, it was good to see that the market came back with more stability and strength. Last year, the total developer new home sales was about 10,800 with a modest price increase of 3.3%. So this has really outpaced the 3 years preceding that where annual volume is about 6,000 to 7,000 and of course, the high was in 2021, right, when we saw about 13,000 new home sales and a price growth of close to 11%. So actually, we like that. I mean we think that that's a sign of a more stable, healthy market where moderate price growth, but the volumes have really come back and we've also seen that the core central region, the CCR has also come back in favor. I mean there were a couple of years where really the RCR and the OCR will getting all of the action. But last year, it was good to see that CCR was finding favor. Again, I think it's a change in lifestyle.

And of course, whichever region you're talking about, I mean bulk for the buyers tend to be Singapore and majority, Singaporeans or PR. So there's a very small percentage of foreigners buying. And that's same with Newport residents as well, which our profile later. And across our commercial portfolio, you can see that Singapore office, Singapore retail and, of course, are also sizable U.K. commercial, which is the 3 commercial buildings we have there, all showing very stable and strong occupancies. And our hotels managed to eke out a higher -- slightly higher RevPAR, even though globally, the performance was quite mixed last year.

So in terms of our FY 2025 financial highlights, we have revenue of $3.6 billion, which was a 9.7% increase from the year before. And obviously, we have a really nice PATMI of around 630 , up over 200%. PATMI have been high [indiscernible] Yes, so called even closer to $800 million, not for the fact that we thought it would be a prudent time to do some impairments. So we did $155 million of impairments and for impairments and foreseeable losses, mainly for our 2 China commercial properties 1 was this Shenzhen, which is a business part and business parts are primarily office in nature. So the commercial market is really struggling very badly in China, which should not come as any surprise to all of you. And then the other 1 is also for commercial complex in Shanghai. So that was a bit of a pity, Otherwise, we really could have reported an even stronger set of results. But Nonetheless, we're still happy at where we have been our NAV and our -- well, I'll use the NAV, the 1 where fair value IPs and hotels, I mean, is narrowing. I mean -- despite the fact that we did a lot of capital recycling last year and had contracted divestments of $2 billion. But NAV has gone up because as we sell and especially above book value, we're really crystallizing a lot of value. And obviously, that goes into retained earnings, which drives up the NAV. So really glad to see us narrowing this gap and unlocking the value and as some of you would have seen this morning when we released our results, I mean, hopefully, the dividend comes as a nice -- as a welcome news to our shareholders. We proposed a final dividend -- ordinary dividend of $0.25. So added to the 3 that we paid in the interim, it's $0.28. And which is a 40% payout ratio. And at the same time, we've also committed to a new dividend policy because in the past, it was -- while as management, we had always articulated that we will try to pay out 1/3 every year. But was really never formalized in our policy. So we thought, I think it would be a good thing to really show our commitment to sustainable shareholder return. So we will pay a minimum of 35% of reported PATMI every year. And share price last year really has rebounded nicely. I mean, of course, we had some of our own internal issues in the earlier part of the last year, but we're glad that we managed to get them resolved. And despite the macroeconomic challenges we pushed forward.

Global portfolio. Obviously, the 1 worth looking at is the bottom line because that's where we fair value, so you get a full sense of our assets line. Singapore has always makes up around half of our asset base with the rest spread towards U.K., China and others. Yes. So as mentioned earlier, I mean, we are really strong hard to ensure that we recycle capital at a higher pace, especially since we wanted to try to bring our gearing down. Gearing did go up in the end because we ended up winning more GLS in Singapore than we expected. And of course, we had that hotel acquisition but all in all, Gearing is at a manageable level, and we will target in the midterm towards bringing it down in a very significant manner.

So just to give you a snapshot of the last couple of years from 2023 to 2025, what our capital recycling focus has been like. most years, the blue bar, the investments acquisitions will usually surpass the yellow bar. But last year, we were fortunate. I mean, where the gold bar actually was higher, and again, that was because of our efforts to accelerate our recycling. Two things I want to mention here. So 1 some of you would have heard me say this before, is that the gold bar includes all the land we buy in Singapore. But obviously, when we develop into residential and sell the individual units, that's not in the blue bar. So it's a bit of a mismatch and it works against us in a way, but it's a way to be very disciplined, okay?

The second thing to mention is that sometimes you will see now results financially. I mean, in our accounting, there may be some difference in terms of when the acquisitions or divestments happen, but we don't double count. So an example is [ STN, ] right? I mean we signed the land tender with the government and were awarded the land in December 2024, but we only made payment like in January, right? So I count that in our acquisitions in 2024. But cash-wise, the cash only left our balance sheet and therefore, financially, P&L-wise as shown in 2025.

Likewise, last year, as you know, we announced a bevy of divestments and all were completed in 2025, except for Keyside arm, okay, in Sentosa. That 1 was -- so when the deal goes hard, when I sign and it goes hard, we show it as a divestment. So that was in December last year, so just 3 months ago, but we actually completed in February. So again, a bit of this accounting mismatch, but we -- as I said, we don't double count. So we show that strictly in the year that we announced it, that's the year that gets shown at, but sometimes on the P&L may be a bit different.

This is our Singapore residential launch pipeline. So really happy that we have a launch pipeline of 1,820 and we look forward. I mean to, hopefully, replenishing a little bit more land this year, even though we are very fortunate to have won 1 of the first few tenders of the GLS tenders of the year, which is [ Tangzhong Ru, ] which is an amazing location, and we're very excited to unveil our project there. And that's a 90-10 JV with our main contractor, [indiscernible] and as you all know, the other sites were acquired last year, which is Woodlands Drive 17, Senja Close and Lakeside and Lakeside will be launching in the second half of this year. And you can also see some of the launches on the right-hand side that we had launched 2 last year, 1 this year, 1 was the Orito and that has done really, really well above our expectations. The Zion grant, which also did really well. So I was very relieved and pleased to see that. And of course, a new port which thankfully has also done well, which we launched in January.

So this is a Newport residence. This is part of a mixed-use complex, used to be the Fuji Xerox tar. So we're revamping it into residential at the top, service departments in the middle and office in the lower 1/3 of it. And it is freehold and really glad that I think we have achieved good sales average pricing that we've achieved so far. I know there's been a bit of confusion in market because the [ 337 ] is actually what we've priced it at and target to achieve for the whole project. But -- so currently, it's around 3,200 thereabout. So that's the actual pricing. So sorry if there was a bit of confusion the way we wrote the news release. But really excited about this project, we really designed it to be a super luxury -- ultra-luxury residence. And of course, I'm still waiting for that -- that unique by the contact us to buy that very special penthouse unit that 13,000 square-foot single-story penthouse unit with dedicated lift just for that unit and dedicated car parks as well. So Hopefully, we will secure that buyer in the course of the next few months.

Then there's our commercial property, which our commercial properties in Singapore have been very resilient. The last couple of years, the office and retail markets have been very stable, both from a rental and occupancy perspective. So good to see that our buildings are doing well as well. One big news was the strong pre-leasing commitment that we did at Union Square Central, which is the former Central Mall, and we bought Central Square next or from Fast Hospitality Trust. Magee, it was total of 3 sites amalcamated it together. And developing this new mixed-use development. That's going to be very exciting when it's done. So the office component, we have leased up 52% to a single tenant, a government agency. So really happy with it for a very long lease. And -- but the project will only complete in around 2029, so a couple more years to go.

And then we have also driven AEIs. As you all remember, in 2018, we did the AEI for Republic transfer, Tower 1. So including the lobby and everything, that was really big works. That took us 18 months and around $60 million to get that AEI done. So that was a very, very tough effort, but really happy. We've seen very positive rental reversions after doing that. And so we thought we can't leave out its young smaller sibling, which is Repaplaza Tower 2. So we've done that now and more or less completed AEI just progressively doing the Lyft modernization. So really happy with that to and committed occupancy is 100%. Then the cities were more where we also went through a big AEI. I hope some of you have been to see it since we've completed and very excited with the mall and how it looks now, and it seems to have received a very positive feedback from all the visitors.

Global hotel portfolio, and we continue, I think, to look towards refurbishing some of our hotels that are located in strong locations so that we can continue to optimize our portfolio. So -- we have M Social Resort Penang as well as Social Hotel in New York Downtown, both of which used to be branded Millennium. So these are the hotels. And then, of course, we have ongoing development in Sunnyvale, which is in California. -- and that's for a 263-room hotel as well as we are currently undergoing the AEI for this Millennium Hotel that we have in Knightsbridge on Sloane Street.

Global living sector portfolio, it's gone down slightly because we did sell off our Sunnyvale PRS. So the Sunnyvale multifamily asset. So it's around 3.7% now versus 3.9% before Sing dollars, but it's still a sizable portfolio I have to admit, we have not monetized it as fast as we should have really us building up this was, firstly, a diversification for CDL, other than doing our usual residential for sale and offices and retail for lease. This was something that was -- the living sector is something that we really believe. And then -- it's something that plays up to our expertise, right, of development -- property development, asset management as well as hospitality, right, service. So we really focused on investing in this sector over the last couple of years and I built it to actually, I would say, a very good scale -- and there are many assets in there that are performing very well. But we did this not only to enhance recurring income and diversify asset class, but really was also to seed our fund management. So I have to admit the fund management efforts have been slower than we would have liked. But we are very, very focused on that. So this year, I hope to really accelerate that. So I can come back with good news to you by the time the half year results swing around. So -- but it's a very, very good and nice portfolio for us and lots in there that we can play around with from a private and a public markets perspective.

I thought I'd just put up this slide also because I realized that in reading the analyst research reports, many of you occasionally will write about these sites. So -- and yes, this is what we call legacy. It's not super old, but it is from acquired between 2013 and 2017, okay? And it's -- there's an external development manager that's managing all these projects. And we have to say that this portfolio has underperformed. So therefore, we endeavor to recycle this as quickly as we can. You will see that we have sold Ransoms Wharf -- so we did that at the end of 2024. So we're happy that was sold for about GBP 70 million. But -- and then of course, Sydney Street was a development where it's 9 units, and we have gradually sold that. And so all those 9 units are sold out. But there are all these other sites that we have to clear out, right? There's [ per billion ] road, which is currently operating as a car park. And that 1 should give us a very strong gains because we are receiving a lot of very outsized offers for that property. It's very near the Harrods. Then there's a Stag Brewery, which is a 1 million square foot of land development in Richmond in London. Stag Brewery is probably the site of this brewery operations, hence called stage. It's in Mortlake, Richmond. So this one, as you all would have seen in the news as well, last year in 2025, we finally got planning approval after 10 years. So -- it's -- now that we got the planning approval, we want to -- definitely, we don't want to build it out. So we're going to move to see how we can monetize this as quickly as we can. Development house is actually an office building that has permits for redevelopment. But we are assessing, again, how best to unlock value there. Teddington Riverside is a bit said, it was a land that we bought and then we actually have built out and completed the buildings with a total of 224 residential units, but unfortunately, 148 remain unsold. So -- it's something that we really have to accelerate more and some things we're looking at are potential bulk sales of the units to buyers that may be interested -- so -- and then the lastly, CheshanStreet is a very upmarket place in Belgravia, -- but -- it's 6 units, but again, took a very long time, and we only sold half of it. So -- so again, all this with ransoms, it was almost close to $1 billion. So now it's about , it's about $800 million that's sitting on our balance sheet. So this is something that we are very committed to unlocking the value there and monetizing it. So I just wanted to flesh this up since I know it's been mentioned quite a few times.

I won't spend too much time here. But last year, we were also grateful to have received industry accolades. And we did make a sizable donation us in partnership with our Chairman, Queen. So together, we donated the SIT, and there's an administrative building there named in favor of him, in allo of him. And of course, we also launched the CDL EcoTain City Square Mall, which has been very, very popular with a lot of visitors, especially those with interest and sustainability. And of course, the rest of the accolades on the right.

As mentioned earlier, we endeavor to give sustainable shareholder returns. I -- this was some of the feedback that we have gotten from investors, which is why is there no clear dividend policy articulated. So I think we really discussed it as a management and a board, and we decided that, look, let's really commit to paying minimally 35% based on our reported PATMI, of course, this year, for 2025, we have decided to do a 40% payout ratio. And I think, yes, I mean, there are some companies out there that probably have more aggressive dividend payout ratios. But I think we also need to ensure that we leave some flexibility. There's always a balancing act between us using the cash to pay down debt or to deploy for new acquisitions and investments. So we thought will give us some flexibility. But at least it's a floor and it's a commitment to our shareholders, and it's something that's sustainable, right? I mean if I -- go out announcing some super high number. It may come back to TripMomin the future. So yes, we're happy to announce a total dividend of $0.28 for the year and a record TSR last year 62%. -- last slide for me before I pass the Yim Ming, we continue, okay, to look towards our value creation and our value unlocking. We have to continue to drive forward with our capital recycling. As I've mentioned to you all before, this is not a one-off that we're going to do for 1 year or 2 years. From now on, capital recycling to be every much a part of our business as property development and asset management, right? I mean we don't just develop properties to sell or manage our office and retail portfolio. I mean we're also in the business of investment, right? I mean, things like our Osaka Hotel, we buy it. And 2 years later, we sell it for 60%, 70% above valuation that's a sign of a good investor, and we will not hesitate to monetize opportunities like that. So really, we have the capital recycling is business as usual for us. And to me, it's it's core, okay, because it's part of what we do. And in portfolio optimization, we continue to optimize and see where are the geographies and asset classes we need to be in.

Fund management. As I mentioned earlier, something we do need to pay more attention to and put in more effort into accelerating need to continue to keep our eyes focused on the ROE, although that's more of a midterm thing because I need all the other pieces to fall in place and then ROE will take care of itself. Capital management, we are still prudent about managing our cash, our gearing recurring income. We continue to drive that, and that's been helped also by our living sector portfolio. Diversification is still important. Singapore is an important market to us. We'll always remain probably our biggest market but we do need to have a diversification across geographies and asset classes and of course, sustainability, right, something we have to do our part for the world. And I guess before I hand it over to Yim Ming also, I may as well just mentioned this since it's also people in the market have gotten wind of it is that sometime in around September, last year, we engaged a global advisory firm to help us do a strategic review of our entire strategy and operations. We are still in the process.

The first step that they did was do an investor perception audit, so reach out to a slew of our buy side and sell side in order to really get feedback for us, right? How are we viewed by the market, by shareholders, by investors, by analysts, where are the perception gaps? And this feedback has been extremely helpful and has allowed us to then journey on together with them and are so for management and the Board to really go on this journey where we want to come up with something that will be -- that will close this perception gap. And that will give you even better guidance as to where CDL is heading towards and allow you to measure us and hold us more accountable for what we say we're going to do. So we're still in the process, so I can't talk too much about it.

But in terms of time line, I hope that by no later than the middle of the year, by June, no later than June. I hope we will be able to announce something to everyone.

Okay. Thank you very much on to Yim Ming and I'll field your questions in Q&A later.

Thank you, Sherman. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen.

So I'll start off with this chart. So pleased to report there's growth in all 3 operating segments across all 3 key metrics, Revenue, EBITDA and PBT. And 3 is my favorite number. Okay. For revenue, the group reported a 9.7% increase in revenue for FY 2025. This slide shows revenue by each segment. While PD contributes 33% to total revenue in FY 2025. The increase in revenue is actually attributable to this segment, which increased by 24%. The steadfast execution and successful sale launches are commendable, and our Singapore PD segment delivered a stellar performance. Projects that contributed included the Mist Norwood Grand and Union Square residences as well as the sale of ransomware and the office component of 1 city center in Suzhou. Joint ventures are equity accounted for, and the revenue do not include these JV projects. On a like-for-like basis, the revenue from these JV projects would have contributed $1.8 billion to 2025 revenue. Hotel operations ticks up 46% of total revenue and increased 1.7% in FY 2025, following a 1.3% increase in RevPAR. The increase in RevPAR is due to Australia and New Zealand portfolio, New York hotels, rest of Europe with the acquisitions of Houghton Paris Opera in May 2024 and holiday in Kensington in December '25. One outstanding hotel -- it's also in U.K., which is a bit more Minar. Please go visit day if you visit the U.K. This more than covers the power performance in Singapore, where RevPAR decreased 5.5% due to -- not the other hotels that we didn't do as well as Beijing hotel, which has weaker or because of the China economy slowdown. For investment properties, the revenue is driven by higher contribution from City Square Mall as well as Tongchuang Shopping Center in Pukit, following -- reaping the benefits of our AEI programs. [indiscernible] $5 billion for FY 2025, 43% higher than 2024. EBITDA demonstrates strong cash generation and is one focus area we look at very closely. Our target is typically a $1 billion annual EBITDA for healthy cash generation. This outperformance $1.5 billion EBITDA was due to our capital recycling gains. PD property development EBITDA increased 81% to $261 million for 2 other than projects earlier mentioned for revenue contributors. The other JV projects that contributed to EBITDA included the fully sold EC Copen Grand, which optinTOP this year, Kenning, the Orica as well as Temporent. .

For FY '25, Sherman mentioned, we made a $8.5 million of foreseeable losses. For hotel operations, EBITDA increased 35% for FY 2025. This EBITDA included capital recycling gains from JW Marriott and comfort in -- excluding such capital residement gains and impairment write-backs. -- hotel operations EBITDA dropped slightly by about 5% with cost pressures as GOP margins fell 1.4% due to weaker performance largely in Singapore and Rest of Asia.

For investment properties, they are the biggest contributor to EBITDA, contributing 46% of total EBITDA. This segment saw substantial capital recycling gains, offset by impairment losses relating to 2 commercial properties in China, 1 of which is slated for sale and has been transferred to asset held for sale. Notwithstanding the our resilient performance of our commercial properties and the growing living sector reflected about 8% of performance in this asset performance.

Next, we'll move on to PBT by segment. The explanations are largely similar to EBITDA earlier. PBT more than doubled to $772 million. Once again, investment properties is the biggest contributor. And all 3 segments reported improvements in PBT versus FY 2024. This can is peak. For hotel and investment properties, they improved by 33% and 145%, respectively. And property development improved multiple force. This is due to the fact that profits from property development is lumpy in nature. So in last year, there was no EC TOP. There was high financing costs, and there was construction delays. 2025, we have a TOP for 1 of the EC as well as very good construction progress and the softer financing environment. PBT is impacted by financing costs. On financing costs, our gross interest expense has decreased by 12% to $520 million. We hope to see this trend further down in 2026, sounds like Broken record, we depreciate our investment properties and in challenging circumstances like today with where we encounter valuation headwinds. I think this conservative accounting policy of depreciating does benefit in its benefits. On capital management, continue to have strong and robust fundamentals. We have a balanced debt expiry and currency profiles for bonds expire in 2026, we will look to issue new bonds. Gearing at 71% vis-a-vis last year at 69%. So we mentioned other than the $1.7 billion acquisitions for 3 GRS in the hotel. We also paid for Syntiant site as well as CapEx on our investment properties. So this is offset by our recycling efforts of IB that Sherman mentioned earlier.

Cash of $2.1 billion with uncommitted undrawn credit facilities of 4.2 very, very strong position. But if you wonder why is the cash drop from $3.1 billion to $2.1 billion is because we have set it money in December 2025 to pay for Syntiant. So interest cover also improved to 3.6x on the back of stronger EBITDA. So for fixed debt, we are at 44% down. 70% of Singapore debt is actually fixed and 11% of GPP debt is fixed. So this puts us in an advantageous position. We are able to assist better opportunities or rate cuts by the Bank of England. Average borrowing costs went down nicely to 3.7%.

And the last slide for FX risk, we do not take speculative position. We do a lot of natural hedging. So we're very comfortable with a 77% natural hedge. I think if 1 were to ask, why is the renminbi hedge is a little bit low, and we all know that we cannot borrow for land in China, which is why that's a slightly bigger exposure for in. So other than that, we acknowledge there's challenges in USD currency, there's volatility, but we are managing it. It's definitely within our risk tolerance levels as well. So with that, I hand over back to Belinda.

Thank you very much, Sherman and Yim Ming for the presentation. We would like to move to the second part part of today's briefing, which is the Q&A. Please feel free to ask your questions, and my colleagues are standing around the room with microphones. And if you have any queries, those who are joining us on webcast, you may post your questions by clicking on the question tab. So before asking your questions, may we please request that you introduce yourself and the organization turn that you represent. Okay. So I'm going to just go straight into opening up the floor. Okay, I have a Mervin first.

I'm Mervin from JPMorgan. Congrats on the strong results and strong share price performance, which I think reflects the market's confidence in your leadership Sherman. Two questions from me, how we can maximize value, improve the operations. Is there anything particular feedback that resonates with you the most? And where is the main perception gaps. Second, question is on cost of debt, a significant drop to 3.7%. Any guidance for this year? And if you were to sell your U.K. assets, the $800 million, how much is the current U.K. debt at this point? .

Yes. I mean we received a lot of very detailed feedback, which was extremely helpful and some from the analysts seated in this room, those who the firm picked. And -- there were many more gaps, perception gaps than we realized. So -- and I think certainly, 1 of the things we look towards doing is rightsizing our portfolio as well as ensuring that we retweak our so-called capital allocation priorities from a geography and an asset class perspective. So that's something we're still in discussion. I mean -- and there may be some changes that may be coming up. And also, of course, I think 1 of the things that came through very strongly from this exercise was on the disclosure side. While I think I've traditionally viewed us as a company with pretty good disclosure. I think we've been pretty open and transparent about all of our activities and our results and the things we are doing and our strategic priorities. But certainly, one thing that we could do better, I think it's to provide more sign post more way finding for investors to show them how we're going to progress forward in the next couple of years. And to really -- so that they can really figure out for themselves if CDL executes on everything that they have laid out, okay, what will the CDR of 3 years or 5 years from now, what would that look like? And do I like what that looks like, right? So that can also form part of an investor -- so-called determination of whether to invest in our stock. So I think that's the fair thing to do is to provide a stronger guidance and more concrete numbers behind it. So these are the things that we kind of got out from it. Yes, on a more macro -- on a more micro level on the strategy side, there are also quite a few things feedback that I think we take very seriously. Obviously, we can't talk too much about it right now, but it will probably involve rebalancing some of our portfolio, too.

Second one, I think, Yim Ming, you can take.

Yes. For cost of debt guidance, I don't expect anything more than 3.5%, and that's probably conservative. And for U.K., that portfolio, I mean we do central treasury as we have said many times. So we will obviously -- unless we have some good investments would obviously go towards reducing that in entirety. .

Okay. On the first row, maybe Derek take yours off and then move the second one. .

I guess just on the results itself. A bit of a good record Pete, but just a bit of noise over there. If you strip out all the one-off investments impairments, et cetera, what is the core Padme and we could be -- that we are looking at? That's first question. .

Okay. Derek, -- before I let Yim Ming answer that, I just want to emphasize again okay, which I had mentioned just now, I think it's not I don't think it's appropriate to look at these so-called capital recycling activities as a one-off because firstly, as I mentioned, it's going to be business as usual for us going forward. If I so aside from developing property and managing our office and retail. I mean if I invest well in something and I sell it 2 years later for a big profit, so that doesn't count towards my earnings. I mean -- as I said, CDL is also a good and astute investor. Yes, I mean, we've had some steps over the years, but generally, I think we've done well on our investment. So I think we really shouldn't keep seeing that as noncore. And likewise, on the flip side, right, I mean, if I invest in a commercial property in China, and it does really badly, and I take impairments and write-downs. That should be held against me. We should be held as a management team accountable for what we've done, right? If we keep stripping off all these one-offs, right, then then it will be very easy. I'll just focus on doing property development and everything else is noncore, right? So again, I would be careful about how we use that term. But I get where you're coming from. So maybe I'll let Yim Ming answer that.

So sorry. doesn't that like the question clearly Yes. By having said that, yes, .

So we reported about $330 million of PATMI. So if I were to exclude divestments as well as impairment losses, which have made substantially, it's probably in the range in -- so as we mentioned, from a management perspective, we don't look at that as a key performance measure. We really look at EBITDA and we look at reported PATMI and ROE. So I guess that probably contextualize us how we look at things as well. .

Yes, that's fair. I mean to your point as well, you are going to link dividend payouts to reported PATMI also. But I guess with you going forward, will you give -- and you alluded to more corporate governance as well. Would you I guess, formalizes the divestment targets in your outlook? .

Yes. So capital allocation as well as divestment targets are part of this internal strategic review that management and the Board will go -- is going through with this advisory firm. And so therefore, we are excited by midyear to hopefully announce something that will be well received by shareholders and investors. .

Okay. And just 1 last question if I may on -- we put the U.K. development -- U.K. legacy platform, $800 million. Mortlake step brewery is in there as well. So can you just take it that you are planning to divest entirely .

Short answer, yes, Derek, the intention is to divest that whole portfolio -- so we are working on it. I mean, some of that stuff, as I said, 1 has already divested the site for GBP 70 million [indiscernible] . So but we will accelerate the so-called the monetization of this portfolio. This year, certainly, we want to accelerate this faster. .

Okay. Let me just move to the second row, Shan, maybe you'll go first and then I'll move down. .

This is Shan from Goldman. Just a follow-up on dividends, right? -- the $0.25 as soon as ordinary. And is that absolute laon that you will keep going forward? Because that actually implies $220 million, which is above your core PATMI. So then -- the second question is then on divestment. Is that also your underwriting assumption that there will be a minimum level of divestment gain going forward?

Shan. So or in -- just for a second, like. It was about dividend, sorry. I was thinking about your second question. And then Saigon the first one. Okay. So the dividend -- the final dividend is $25 million, but added to the interim, it's 3, right? So it's $0.28 for the year. So a 40% payout ratio. And you are asking?

So most companies will keep the ordinary flat. That means that same model is .

I got a ton. I went through 1 of those moments when I was thinking about something else Yes. In the past, CDL had this habit, right, of declaring a lot of so-called special dividends, right? Our interim is special. There there's a special final and ordinary final I mean I think we discussed it at length at the board yesterday and management's recommendation is to probably do away with this terminology or special. I mean, it's really not that special. I mean we've committed to it now. our dividend policy, right, of a minimum of 35% or more. So I think anything within that range should not be considered special. It's something that we have committed to doing. So it's an ordinary dividend. Now if we were to do some means to be seen, it depends how unlike another developer who has made a Board announcement. I will not be pegging our dividend to the like growth divestment value or something. But again, our reported PATMI captures all that in, right? So I think that's a very fair metric to use when we have pegged our dividend policy to it. .

So -- and the second part was since I was still in twilight zone wine just now. Yes. So I've answered that as well, right?

So Yes. Okay. Okay. Sorry. My second question is on NAV and RMB -- if I compare this to number for against 2019 number, NAV has declined 9%, but RNAV is up, I think, about 9%. -- against 2019. Can you help us reconcile this number? What that has been developed up so significantly. And just 1 last question on net gearing, right? If I take a look at your net gearing is actually trending up. this goes against what you mentioned earlier about midterm deleveraging plans. So can you share what are the near-term goals over the next 12 months?

Okay. I'll take the gearing question, then I'll pass it to Yim Ming . So thank you, Sean. So for the gearing, as mentioned earlier, I mean, we were fortunate to have won more less sites than we expected. So 3 last year, and land is not exactly cheap in Singapore. But the good thing is that, I mean, all this gearing is on your balance sheet for a finite time, right, as you develop. I mean this gearing will start to progressively go down anyway. So we don't see that something alarming. And yes, I mean, that hotel acquisition at the end of last year, about SGD 480 million, I mean, that certainly pushed up our gearing by quite a bit around 3 percentage points. But -- but putting that aside, I mean, as you yourself mentioned, then, it is a midterm target. I know I did say that we want to get the gearing down. But ultimately, I also don't want us to be too fixed on the gearing because I think every property developer is different. Yes, they are Hong Kong property developers where gearing is in the teens or the 20s but different strokes for different folks, I suppose. And for us, I mean, our midterm target is to get the gearing down to at least around 60% -- but in the interim, right, I don't want to -- just because of gearing then, okay, let's not tender for land in Singapore. Let's not buy anything else. We'll just keep divesting I think that we'll do a great disservice to our growth strategy because no matter what, we still need to keep growing -- so -- but the gearing will come down over the next few years. That's certainly a commitment I've made -- but yes, it did actually track up. So I do understand the rationale for your question. So -- but yes, thankfully, not by a lot, and it will start to trickle down as we progress further with our capital recycling and continue to be selective about the acquisitions we make. Yim Ming, do you want to address the NAV?

You're really sharp. But the NAV for IP, I mean, if you notice, right, the NA for IP has gone out slightly, largely because of our China portfolio. So if you look at valuations wise, for our 2 China portfolios -- our China commercial properties, valuation has actually come in probably in the range of about at least 10% lower than the previous year. So they probably accounted for that. But overall, RNAV has gone up, I think, largely also because of South Beach. I mean, very frankly, that has improved our base NAV for one, and our hotels valuations actually came in also a little bit better this year versus last year. But if I can just add on the NAV, I know it's a key focus that many people look at whether this number is real. I just wanted to assure the audience that for these NAV calculations, firstly, for the IP portions, they are mostly externally valued. -- but we don't announce all the valuation reports because we're not a REIT. So they are either -- for the Singapore properties, they actually mostly external value all overseas properties are actually also excellently valued, and we use people like Cushman, et cetera. As for the hotels, after we privatize MC in 2019, we had the ability to value all the hotels. So while the hotel valuations are not the most recent, but in 2020, we did to clean about 90% of our hotel portfolio. So progressively, we just keep doing valuations. So suffice to say that I think the valuations number, we stand by it, basically supported by most external valuations. .

Congrats Joy from HSBC. Just following up on Sean's question on dividend. So given that the PATMI can be quite volatile depending on recognition and divestment -- how much would you want to keep your dividend more volatile? Or you want dividend to be a bit more stable? How should we think about the linkage to PATMI itself? Second question, just in terms of divestment targets. You singled out U.K. portfolio for potential divestment. Is there any other obvious segments that you want to sort of divest -- thank you

So on your first question, Joy. By the way, welcome. -- your first question, yes, I mean, we -- because the dividend policy is pegged to reported PATMI. So something that we will have the endeavor to try to keep it as stable as possible. Yes, last year, 2025 was a record year. So it's -- we're going to have to work very hard to try to keep the levels up. That's why I said, right? This capital recycling has part of our business as usual and it can't just be a one-off. And the good thing is that we have a sizable portfolio, and we continue to invest as well, right? As I said, the Osaka's 1 example, the hotel bespoke Shinsaibashi. I mean that was 2 years ago, and -- and now we have monetized that. So it's something that we will have to continue doing. And there are various levers we can pull to get this done. So yes, it's work in progress for us. You will see that at the end of my presentation that slide with all the nice bubbles around it, but 1 of them is recurring income, right? I mean it's also a key focus for us, and that's why the living sector has played a strong role too, albeit it's also a seed for fund management ambitions because property development is very lumpy, right, with the exception of Singapore, where it's progressive. And other than ECs, all of our overseas development revenue comes as a 1 shot at the end just like ECs, right? So this causes a lot of lumpiness in our earnings. And therefore, we do need a lot of strong recurring income to hold that up to -- and of course, we have to be careful how we invest because impairments and provisions for foreseeable losses can also take a hit on the PATMI, right? So Ultimately, it is a tough job for management. I mean, but we are committed to making this happen. And yes, in the medium term, we hope to really even out so that it's a stable and growing PATMI. .

So that's one. Then the second thing is in terms of divestments, you mentioned about you mentioned about -- I mean, we mentioned about the U.K. development legacy land bank. Of course, we also mentioned about the China commercial properties that we would hope to clear off our balance sheet. And aside from that, yes, there are many other divestments in the pipeline. We don't typically share our divestments, but I can only tell you that it's across geographies and across asset classes. And it would include Singapore as well. So yes, various initiatives that we're pushing forward with. Thank you, Joy. I'm glad I wasn't in the twilight zone for that question.

Okay. I'm going to -- I'm just going to move down quickly this row first and complete this row. Dairy, then after that, Brandon and other Terrane.

Derek from DBS. I've got 2 questions. So my first question is on the relationship with the board. -- as we look to focus on 2026, your strategies, divest invest, could we assume that relationship between management and board you are like Cannavinterms of wanting to take the company forward. So I just wanted to hear your thoughts on that. And second thing is on the land banking. We've been seeing how foreign developers coming in also in Singapore. And I think while the group has been tibiting very actively. I'm just wondering whether are you sensing exuberance in the pricing in the market currently? And if any, how should we think about you adding more land in 2026 Yes. That's all

Thanks, Derek. Went straight for the nail on the head, heading in the nail on the head with that first question. Yes, relationship is a very core deal and very harmonious right now amongst management and together with the Board, I do understand the basis of your question. Last year, we did have some internal issues and of course, some kind of unsightly public disputes, but glad to say that's behind us now. And as a management and Board, I mean, we are trying to really move forward expeditiously so that we can really unlock more value from CDL at a quicker pace. So that's one.

In terms of land banking, the truth is, Derek, I mean, over -- this is not the first time we are seeing -- I mean, over the years, there have been some exuberant years where you see a lot of foreign developers come into the market as well. There was I remember all these Chinese developers, [ Bank ] or they were all coming into our market to also build, right? And of course, many contractors have also now become developers themselves. So it's nothing different from what we've seen, I would say, over the last decade or 2. So we -- land tenders are always competitive, especially if it's a nice plot of land. You're never going to escape with a very low or attractive land price. I think it's always going to be competitive. So I think we have to be just disciplined in how we bid and put our best shot forward. Winning the Tanjong rule side does take some pressure off us because at least we've already got 1 land replenishment done. We will certainly take part in more land tenders this year. But of course, I also have mentioned before that I don't want us to get to the point where overly burdened by a very huge pipeline in Singapore. And should something change, be it locally, i.e., property measures, or for -- in terms of the global macroeconomic conditions, that may severely change the market dynamics and leave us so-called may leave us so-called struggling, I mean, with a larger burden than we would like. So I think we would like to just keep our land bank in prudent -- I mean we will replenish it in a prudent manner, but I think we'd like to keep it at sustainable levels that will not put undue pressure on the company. But certainly, we are glad to have on Tanjong rule, and we will continue to participate in more tenders this year.

Sorry, Sherman, since on that same topic, we have a question from Golar online. And on that same topic, she was asking about capital allocation. And therefore, since what you say that your capital allocation will largely be with the salable land banking? Or would it be other asset classes? .

Yes. Again, as the last few years, I have been the last 2 years, and it was accidental initially. But since 2024 and 2025, I've kind of given out divestment targets. You'll notice that annual divestment targets, you noticed I didn't do it today because, again, I'm waiting for -- I'd like to have this strategic review probably done, and then we'll give our proper targets then not just for divestments, but also for capital allocation for capital deployment.

Brandon?

Sherman and team. Just 3 questions. The first one, are you able to share a bit more on your hotel strategy as of now. I think we have sent you divesting a pretty decent Japan hotel very good premium then subsequently, you bought something very nice in London. So is there a particular strategy? Are you looking at probably like percentage you're going to sell a percentage of managed under maybe link in M&C and percentage you're looking to manage on the third party. Yes. That's my first question.

The second question will be a bit more on the U.K. development platform. So just to confirm, right, if you were to sell the entire $800 million, will it be recognized under revenue or you would recognize sort of a divestment gain or loss below the gross profit level, Yes. That's my second question.

And the third one would also be a bit on divestment -- so we have seen you divesting a very big number in FY '22 and '25 as well with MHS and South Beach. So for this year, are there any really chunky stuff there that we could see you divesting or maybe something like City Square more even like some decent hotels in U.K. or in New York -- why don't you take the

I'll do the easiest one, obviously, so for the U.K. development platform, we -- our original genesis of going in was actually for development sites. -- yes, it's part of our development property will be recorded under revenue, not under other income. .

I think on the hotel on the hotel one, we of course, we do have a review of that as well ongoing. And as you can see, it's not just noncore hotels that we're selling. Sometimes it's also getting the right offer. And if we think it's attractive enough, we do -- we are open to divesting right? So we do have 2 heads. One is a operator. And the other, of course, is the asset owner. So we do have a 2 head strategy. And I think as the operator, we ideally want to have more hotel contracts, especially in gateway city hotels. Today, we're pretty pleased with what we have in terms of where we are represented across different geographies which is very useful in terms of having such a volatility in the market, right? I mean 1 market is down usually and our market picks up this slightly as well. So we definitely want to continue that kind of diversification. But at the same time, I think where we're going is that it doesn't necessarily need to be an invested asset that we must hold ourselves. So on the operator side, I think we're also trying to get ourselves structured for more hotel management contracts and try to grow more through that route as well.

So if you ask me where we can split between the internal and external one? Today, I think, of course, it's majority internal. We have a few external contracts, but albeit those are quite significant ones. We have external contracts with Granier Type Singapore, Stregas and addition. So I'm not able to give you a firm split as to how much we intend to keep in-house and external. But basically every project we look at, we do decide like is it better managed in-house. And I mean some of the considerations can be how many hotels do we already have in that city, right? So we do take all that into account before we decide whether we want to go external internal morning.

Brandon, welcome. And thank you for your kind comments as well. So just to round up, -- as mentioned earlier, I mean, I don't want to share too much about -- I can't share too much about our divestments. And typically, we don't share specific divestment targets. It's interesting. You mentioned like City Square Mall and all this. So thank you for the ideas. But we are taking a very rigorous look and have been at our entire portfolio globally, including in Singapore. So I mean we hope that the ability to surprise on the upside. After all, I don't think any of you expected us to sell South Beach last year. So now that doesn't mean you go and say, "Oh, they're going to sell Republic Plaza or something. That's not going to happen okay? But we are looking -- taking a hard look at our whole portfolio. So as I mentioned, the divestments will spread across geographies, including Singapore as well as overseas. So -- let's see what we come up with. Yes, I mean South Beach is a hard act to beat because it was a big asset. I mean -- but we are thankful and fortunate to have a diverse portfolio. .

Okay, Wilson and then after I'll go to Terence and [indiscernible].

The management as Wilson from Jefferies. Just 2 questions. The first on fund management progress, which Sherman mentioned earlier that you hope to accelerate. So just could you share any early thoughts on considerations you have in building up the fund management platform and whether you be considering new platforms, existing public private? And the second question is back to the legacy U.K. development platform, the $800 million worth of carrying value sounds like there is being prioritized to recycle as quickly as you can? Or would you say it's fair to expect like within the next 12, 24 months, this will be totally fully recycled. Thank you.

Somehow, I guess, people really want us to commit to certain targets. And once -- and the reason I'm hesitant is because once I throw something out, right? I do want to walk back from that. But okay, to address your second question first, Wilson, first of all, U.K. development platform my aim is to monetize that all of it this year, but I will say it's not easy, I mean, but that's our aim. I mean -- so let's see if we can hit our own internal targets. For the fund management side, as I mentioned earlier, I mean, it's something wished we had paid a bit more attention to it and accelerated the efforts there. As you know, the last time we tried was to inject our U.K. properties and IPO in a REIT listed in Singapore. So -- that was a big colossal effort. And when that didn't go through, I mean, I think we kind of focused on other things. But really, it's now time to monetize more of our, for instance, our living sector portfolio of $3.7 billion that I put up earlier. I have to say that it will be mostly in private platforms, private formats. I don't think the capital markets are suitable for some of the assets that we have. And for the ones that we wanted to listen in the in a public format like the 3 commercial buildings in the U.K. are now still not the right time. So I think need a while more before the office sector and the capital markets come back in favor. So probably focusing more on the private side. But we do have a lot, I mean, that we are in a lot of discussions on some of our assets. And also, as I said, in addition to this, I mean, we thankfully do have 2 public platforms under fund management. So 1 is obviously CDL Hospitality Trust. And that we are also looking at how we can be a better sponsor to the -- and the other is, of course, Irene also listed on the exchange. I mean so these 2 REITs, I mean, we are also paying a lot closer attention to see how we can work better with the REITs. .

Okay. I'm mindful of time. So I just want to have to take 2 more here, and then I got to move over to the media group. So yes, maybe Terence, you kicked off. .

Is Terence from UBS. Just in the spirit of clarity, what is the time line for midterm defines for ROE and gearing? And relatedly on ROE, I think it's good that you're guiding for PATMI growth and the dividend policy is also welcome as well. But I think the equity denominator would still grow over time by a faster pace, making it harder to grow ROE. So then is it fair for us to expect a capital reduction exercise ensure you mentioned outsized dividend? And specifically also, is that likely is there a likely consideration to be in the same time frame as we think about the first question on ROE and net gearing. .

I have a last one, if I may. Residential, the margins on the consolidated projects look a bit low. -- think it's 4.7% versus 10% in the last year. The question is why? And perhaps a comment on the recognitions and margins outlook for 2026. Thank you.

So I'll address your question first, Terence. I again, because I want to wait until the proper juncture. So when our internal strategic review is completed before I really give you a time frame. But I think you would have heard me in previous and things I have thrown out ROE target, a midterm ROE target of 8%, okay? It's not easy for us to get there, as you mentioned, right, the shareholder equity component is very big. So -- but therefore, it's something that we will really need to drive our fund management at a faster pace if we aim to get there, right? I mean -- so that's 1 way of really lifting our ROE. So we do need to be more efficient -- and we -- I can't comment on like capital reduction on that at the moment, margins. You want to talk about it, Yim Ming?

Yes. Actually, for the margins, if you exclude the foreseeable losses that we made for China properties, I need to give credit, our residential margins actually improved between the 2 years. So when they calculate the 4%, I believe that has been factored in the foreseeable losses. And that's actually the main reason. So I think in terms of margins, very healthy, I would say, yes. Okay. Thank you. .

Vijay, the last time I'm going to move over to the media team. .

Vijay here from RHB. Maybe just 2 quick questions. Firstly, on Delphi Archer, there was a plan to unlock value for our strategic developments. Maybe any update on that? And my second question is in terms of Singapore residential land banking, I see you are a bit more active in terms of EC sites. Maybe can you give a bit of idea? Is it a derisking strategy and risk versus returns on EC versus private site, some color on that. Thank you. Did you

Sorry Vijay, did you say unlock strategic divestments?

No. Delphi Orchard, there was a...

Delfi Orchard I see Yes, Delphi Orchard into. .

So thank you -- so in terms of your question, the first 1 about value. That is 1 way as well is by really doing so-called our portfolio optimization. So that's the enhancement part, right, of our GET strategy. And it's really looking at our existing assets and seeing how we could really enhance and unlock the value there. So we are doing 2 redevelopments at the moment. One is, as I mentioned earlier, Newport resident -- Newport Plaza, which is the entire complex that used the Fuji Rock stars, the other is Union Square. So we will continue to drive forward with this. But at the same time, you also have to understand that I've got to keep our gearing and our cash in mind. I started all the redevelopment projects at the same time, so there's also like we could redevelop City house, we could apply for a CBD incentive scheme of 25% bonus GFA and redevelop that. We can also, as you have mentioned, we unblock Delphi. I mean -- and it wasn't a lot of money because we owned a substantial part of it. But if we amalgamated that with Claymore Connect behind Orchard Hotel, that would also become a very sizable mixed-use development. And we have already gone some steps along the SDI, the strategic development incentive scheme. But I do not want to start these projects anytime soon because they now have 4 ongoing re-development projects, right? Already the existing 2 will finish in 2028 and 2029. And then top up another tool, and I will have loss of income as well when I demolish those buildings, it will put a huge strain on the group. So I think there's something we need to pace out and I cannot do it all at once. So that's one. Sing resi, you asked about EC. Yes, EC has certainly been the flavor of the day for the last, I would say, 24 months, all developers have gone very aggressive for EC. I think because EC has always been a very attractive product that allows upgraders to eventually get into the private residential market when the EC finishes it's minimal occupation period, right, so it becomes fully private. So great and then the income ceiling was formally lifted, as you know, from 14,000 to 16,000 and there's been talk about potentially lifting it further. So ECs have really been a very attractive way for upgraders to enter the private market and and it's been in high demand, which hence has driven very aggressive bidding in the last 2 years now. So we have -- we do participate in EC sites as well, and we have been fortunate to win EC sites along the way, including 2 last year. But that doesn't mean that's all we look at. I mean as I said, Tanjong rum, I mean, it was a nice win for us, and that's near Kaland all that. I mean it's a great area to be in. So that's not easy. So I think we will continue to look at sites that are well located and that have locational attributes that we feel will be very attractive to buyers. .

Okay. I'm going to quickly move over to the other side of the room. I see Dexter. Dexter why dont you take the question from the meeting?

Dex from Limburg news. 2 parts. First part this question on the U.K. and China. I know you took markdown there as well. Can I clarify if you guys are playing by opto sell both the U.K. and China assets, how much discounting are you expecting if you all really want to sell? Because as you mentioned, the capital markets in very soft in those 2 parts. The second one, you mentioned before you wanted to U.K. REIT, and I think you mentioned that just now as well. So is the plan on the shelf for now? And -- in terms of private funds, are you talking about setting out a private fund within CEO? And the third one, in terms of strategic of your core businesses,

Firstly, in terms of our divestment I mean, we will go through meticulously right into our portfolio, especially for our noncore and underperforming assets. across all asset classes, right? I mean, be it residential, commercial or hospitality, and we will divest assets that make sense. You all remember in 2024, I think we divested a hotel in broader Colorado, right? I was not even Denver is broader and people -- I'm not sure how many people hotel and border. And then we divested for about and at a gain of about SGD 80 million, right? So -- so it's things like that, right? I mean we look at it fairly. And in some cases, we try to always divest above, obviously, our book value, okay? -- but it may not always be possible. So the flip side is looking at if you keep holding on to the asset, right, how much are you emerging in terms of the cash? I mean, is it loss making? How much debt is on the asset the U.K. development portfolio that the legacy portfolio are put up. I mean that was -- before we sold ransom sales was around SGD 1 billion at the height of the interest rate environment in the U.K. I mean, we're paying 6% interest a year on that whole portfolio -- so that's a lot of waste of money. That's $60 million a year. So I think we ransoms, we divested and evincis going to probably punch me once I say this, but that was at a slight loss. It was about GBP 10 million, I think. So -- but you know what, I mean, you take the good and the bad, right? I'm removing quite a bit of debt off my balance sheet as well. So as we go forward, we assess each asset on the individual basis. Same with China right now is really bad time. You've seen other developers that have exposed to China as well. If you -- I mean, we are still confident in our residential sites, especially our Sinn, right? -- that should do very, very well, exceptionally well. But yes, commercial is uninvestable right now in China. So is going to be challenging for us to divest these. We may have to take some haircuts on it. But the head count is too big. I mean, the good thing about our group is that we do have some holding power as well. I mean, as I've always said to you all before, I don't want to divest just for the sake of meeting divestment targets that are committed to, right, and leaving lots of money on the table. I mean, that is a poorer outcome for CDL if I do that. .

Secondly, on private funds, you're asking whether the funds would be within CDL? Well, when I say private funds, I'm referring to starting a private equity fund that would third-party capital. CDL may be part of that capital stack, maybe an investor as well, an LP in the fund, but it would be a small one. I mean, we would not exceed like 10% or 20% of the fund. I mean we may have to put our money where our office, right, if we're going to start a fund. But it will be largely external funds that we would hope to attract because that's true monetization of assets, right? If I sell the asset in the fund, and I'm 80% of the fund, then what am I doing, right? So that is my intention for the fund management side, private funds.

Strategic view does it include management? Thank you for trying to work me out of a job. I appreciate that Dexter. So -- but I hope it doesn't include management. I mean, if it does, then I'll accept whatever conclusions it comes to, but it does not include reviewing the Board or management. I mean, this is really focused on our strategy. focused on our guidance, focus on our portfolio and asset base. I mean -- so things that really matter the CDL. Yes, I understand Board and management, important to CD as well. But that is up to the shareholders to decide. So.

Quickly to around 2 things then. Obviously, you said last year was a year of reflection. Looking at the U.K. portfolio, what do you think went wrong there in the first place? And secondly, can I ask since the Chairman does have strategic -- edition for the company. What do you think of the review? And do you have a vision of what the strategy would look like. .

Sorry, on your first question, you asked me what went wrong, where --

The U.K.

The U.K. portfolio, high interest rates...

The U.K. portfolio as in the legacy land bank. So I think back then, I mean, it was before my time as well. So it's understandable that that we wanted to get into U.K. developed market, but we had to get an external manager because we did have a team on the ground. So I understand. I think some of the things that went wrong some of the sites were potentially at above market values. So as you know, it always starts with getting a good land price, right? If your land price is wrong, it's quite difficult to catch up subsequently. It's quite challenging to catch up. And so that's 1 of them. And secondly, I think some of them the development manager underestimated the complexity of development permits as well, which is why the whole process has been so lengthy and drawn up -- so I would say those are some of the lessons learned as well for CDL as well. So going forward, obviously, now we have our own U.K. development team. So if we do undertake developments at least, we have our own team on top of it, although team is not involved in that because that 1 is exclusively under the development of a third-party manager. So again, it's things like that we work towards resolving and unlocking the value there or at least unlocking the capital there. so that we can put it to a better use. I as I said, again, I mean I can pass the mic to our esteemed Chairman to answer, but I really don't think it's necessary because at this stage, not of us can comment much on the strategic review, right? In fact, I probably already said more than actually I said today. So if you want to ask him what does he think of the process that he like it or not like it. I mean I don't know how he's going to answer that considering we are not supposed to comment on it because it's going to be a very comprehensive review. But as I've answered your question earlier, suffice to see, right? I mean Board and management are not under the review. So let us know if you like us to be under the review as well. I'll put that out for consideration. If you don't think we're doing a good job. So

Okay, moving quite a long because I know that some of you have to go to the RADARS launch in a short while. So let me just move down to anybody in the friends from the media that is over on this side. If there's any questions pertaining to that? No. Then I had 1 also from Golar from the Edge online, which has to do with City Plaza. I'm not sure if Mr. Sherman will want to comment like like what are the chances of that? And active sales mandate, what is the expected proceeds from the Board denials if it does happen. .

Actually, it's attractive side. I think the -- we are very sparse shareholder in the complex. So they managed to get 80% is some ground. I believe there will be some interest from the potential investors, and I wish him for luck. Thank you. .

So just to clarify, we do have about 16 units on -- is there no there is a funding question. Okay. I'll just give this to the last 1 on the .

Yes. This -- can you give us a hint of what's the current value for U.K. office portfolio at this point in time? The reason why I ask is, if you add up the $800 million the U.K. land bank, Moxi to be sold to CDL HT $475 million. Your PRS, $3.7 billion. That's a relo to $5 billion. So can we say we have in excess of $5 billion to be sold over the next 3 to 5 years. .

Very, very astute and very good, Martin. As I said, again, we won't comment on the targets. Anor, we confirm what you just mentioned, but you're certainly very steel analyst.evening. .

So carrying value of the 3 properties that we have right now is about GBP 870 million. .

So it's GBP 870 million. So that's approaching EUR 6 billion. .

Okay. I'm going to scan the room for more time. Is there any more funding questions on the room, the floor. If there's not, then is there any other comments from the panelists at this -- he will bring this briefing to a close. So thank you very much, everyone, for coming. There's also refreshments being served outside. And for those that are joining us on webcast, thank you very much for taking your time this morning, and we hope to see all of you soon, very soon again. Thank you very much, and have a good year ahead. .

Okay. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, friends from the media, analysts, bankers, investors and CDL colleagues. My name is Belinda, and I'm the Head of Investor Relations and Corporate Communications at CDL. On behalf of the CDL management, thank you so much for joining us today for CDL's briefing on our first half ended June 30, 2025 financial results. Now the first half 2025 was a significant period for our group, but I am so delighted to see everyone here in this room at the M Hotel Singapore as well as the hundreds of you joining us virtually online this morning.

So for today's briefing in line with CDL's commitment to environmental sustainability, we encourage you to please scan the QR code on the screen earlier that was -- so that you can download the documents that were uploaded on SGX. So here is the QR code. For those that are joining on online, you can also similarly download those documents, which are available on the SGX website as well as our CDL website. Now they include firstly, a copy of the detailed financial statement; secondly, a press release summarizing the key highlights of our first half 2025 performance; and thirdly, a presentation deck that the management team will be walking through very shortly. Now for all our guests joining us virtually, you would similarly be seeing these documents online.

I would like to introduce you to the CDL management panel. In the center, we have our Executive Chairman, Mr. Kwek Leng Beng; followed by ExCo members, Mr. Sherman Kwek, our Group CEO, on his right; Mr. Kwek Eik Sheng, our Group COO, on his left; and then Mr. Chia Ngiang Hong, our Group General Manager; and Ms. Yiong Yim Ming, our Group Financial -- Group Chief Financial Officer.

Now the format of today's briefing will be in 2 parts. We will kick off with a presentation of some of the key highlights led by Sherman, then later followed by Yim Ming on the financial highlights, and then we will hit off with the Q&A for an opportunity for us to engage with the panelists.

So without further ado, I would just like to invite Sherman to please come forward and then let's kick start the presentation. Thanks.

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for taking the time to come attend our briefing for our first half results for 2025, and of course, a warm welcome to everyone online as well. I think today, a lot of people joining us online. So great to see your interest. I will take us through our results along with Yim Ming and subsequently we will open up for Q&A. So as Bel has mentioned, I'll present an overview and strategic initiatives. Yim Ming present a financial highlights. We're not presenting the operations review as always, and that's just for your leisure reading in the deck.

Okay. So just an overview of our results for this year. We have done better than the first half last year. Obviously, it could have been a lot better but were hampered by unrealized net exchange losses. This is basically because of USD-denominated loans that we had made to our U.S. operations. And you can see in the text there, right, if not for -- and last year, by the way, was a big gain as well. So this year, the loss was $63 million versus last year, the gain was $51 million. So if you net all that out, that's already a big swing. And as we have put in that small yellow text box there, our PATMI would have gone up by 323%. If not, if you put aside these foreign exchange losses and gains.

So a little bit disappointed exchange didn't work out in our favor because the U.S. dollar depreciated. But otherwise, it was a good set of results, and our Singapore performance on the development side was strong. We also had some divestments. We don't double count. So these divestments that we mentioned there like this Ransome's Wharf site, we sold in London as well as the office component of HLCC of the Suzhou, I mean because they completed in January, so it's counted in this year.

But in terms of our divestments, I mean, we counted as part of last year. So this -- but putting aside divestments, the core earnings were actually stronger this year. And you can see that actually on PBT and PATMI, we did have a good show and we were helped, obviously, by an EC project that completed in the first half of this year, which is a Copen Grand EC is a JV between us and MCL Land. And as per accounting rules for so-called EC projects, you will recognize the full revenue and profit upon completion.

So some highlights of our NAV and our RNAV, which is actually more the reflective number, which includes the fair value of IPs. So of course, we've also given you a snapshot of what it looks like if we also fair value in our hotels. So you can see that we are still trading at a big discount, and we do want to close the gap. NAV has gone down slightly, but we put down the reasons there. So we are doing a special interim dividend of $0.03. And of course, this year, we're expecting quite outsized investment -- divestments. So therefore, hopefully, we'll have a nice surprise for all of you at year-end. Share price performance. Of course, until June 30, it was $5.19. And since then, it has continued to trend upward. So we are also grateful for the market momentum.

Key highlights for this year, as mentioned earlier, we had a total sales revenue, so the amount of -- the value of units that were sold this year has $2.2 billion, which is a 90% increase over the first half of last year. We have sold 903 units, and this is obviously powered by The Orie in Toa Payoh, which is our joint venture project. And since then, we've also started to replenish sites. So we've replenished actually 3 sites. One is Lakeside Drive in Jurong West. And the other 2 sites are not awarded yet, but hopefully, it should be awarded soon. And those are the 2 EC sites that we recently garnered, one is at Senja close, which is in Bukit Panjang and the other is Woodlands Drive. And investment properties portfolio across our group remains stable. As you can see, Singapore office retail has been strong. U.K., I think since last year, we've suffered some effects from the weaker market there. But overall, our 3 commercial properties are still performing well. And of course, the living sector continues to be very, very resilient, and we are grateful for that.

In terms of the hotel operations, it hasn't been that strong of a year for our hospitality side. Notably in Singapore and the U.S. against last year, which were stronger years. We've seen a bit of a dip. But overall, I think the hotel division still performed relatively well. And some of the new acquisitions that we have made have actually come in and provided strong contribution. So things like the Hilton in Paris, in the Opéra District that was acquired early last year. So that has also come in and given a full half year of contribution.

In terms of capital recycling, I think that's something that since last year, we have committed to our shareholders that we will accelerate that. So, so far this year, we have eked out -- we have achieved more than $1.5 billion in contracted divestments, meaning divestments that we contract this year. So again, this amount does not include Ransome's Wharf Suzhou office and retail component and stuff like that. So no double counting. And of course, we also sold a few other properties in Singapore, City Industrial Building, we are under contract for Piccadilly Galleria, which is the commercial component for our JV project, Piccadilly Grand in Strata park. And of course, the biggest one was South Beach, which we're selling our 50.1% stake to our joint venture partner. In the U.S., we also have managed to get 2 sales, 1 completed and 1 contracted.

This slide, we flash it up at every briefing, but hasn't changed much. I mean, the top line -- the top row represents basically at our book value. And so the more useful one is the bottom row, which is the fair value of our IPs and hotel assets. And same here, you can see Singapore still accounts for close to 50% of our total asset base. Obviously, the one on the right by business segment will vary. It depends on how much land -- development land that we replenish in Singapore at any one time. So between IP, which is investment properties and DP, development properties, it will fluctuate somewhat. But it gives you a good snapshot of kind of where we are at right now.

Okay. So on to our GET strategy, which everyone is very familiar with, so I'm not going to elaborate on it. As mentioned earlier, I think we have been very disciplined in our land replenishment strategy, and we are very pleased that this year, we've been able to replenish 3 sites because we are running somewhat low in terms of our land bank. We do have Newport residences, which thankfully, we don't have any pressing deadline. So we're still kind of holding there to see when it would be optimal time to launch this luxury project at the Greater Southern Waterfront. Zyon Grand is our JV with Mitsui Fudosan Asia. And so that we're targeting for early Q4 launch. Hopefully, that will do well. I think all of you have seen the previous weekend, the one before this past weekend where I think there were 2 new launches in that area, and River Green and Promenade Peak and both have done well. So hopefully, that's a good sign in August well for Zyon Grand. And yes, the only launch we've done this year is The Orie, which we are 92% sold right now. So we continue, I think, to do what we do best, which is Singapore land development.

And at the same time, obviously, we -- as I mentioned earlier, we have committed to ensure that every year we are deploying funds for new GLS tenders in Singapore as well as for overseas land development as well as commercial assets. So we have to ensure, I think, that we keep our gearing in check. So obviously, our gearing has ticked up a bit because we have done 3 GLS tenders in Singapore successfully. So -- but with the contracted divestments that we've done this year, I think that will hold things in check. And plus, I mean, there's a pipeline of many more divestments to come. So hopefully, I think people, shareholders will be very delighted with the news as we announced them over time. But this is what we have done this year.

And just, again, to give you a bit more insight into this, we -- although I had verbalized it in previous analyst briefings, but just to say again, the numbers are a bit skewed because on the divestment side, we don't include residential unit sales, right? So if I buy a piece of land in Singapore, it's included in my investment side. But when I sell the individual units, I mean that I don't include that in divestment. So divestment is really for pure divestment of assets or land that's undeveloped.

So this number is going to look a bit skewed. But having said that, despite that we have $1.2 billion of investments this year, for the first half of this year, and the whole amount of that was for the 3 GLS sites in Singapore, we still have actually done divestments that's far greater than that amount. So I think this will show you our discipline as we move forward. Now doesn't mean that we won't make any more investments for the second half of this year. I think as you divest, I mean, you -- we are trying to optimize our portfolio, and we're also going to seize on good opportunities that allow us to either grow our future land bank, be it locally or overseas or have assets that are very complementary to our portfolio that are currently undervalued because certain markets are weaker or dislocated.

So from time to time, we will still make investments, but I think we are trying to demonstrate our commitment to having an active divestment strategy, capital recycling strategy, as I call it, that will move forward and be a constant part of our business because we can't just keep buying. I mean, we also have to sell.

This slide just showing you our so-called accolades and recognition that we gained so far, especially on the sustainability side. I've mentioned earlier, I think it's an important part. I mean, we have to care about this planet that we live on as part of our social responsibility. And so I think we continue to push forward on this front where I would say we are one of the leading firms in Asia when it comes to CSR.

On to the last bit, which is on transformation. Just to give you a flavor of where we're at now, why do we put the global living sector within transmission. I think 2 reasons for it. One, it's -- these are kind of new asset classes to us, while it is real estate, but these are all basically recurring income in nature and therefore, people that live in. And so because we decided since a couple of years ago that we're going to focus on building up scale here, we've been gradually working towards it and hasn't been easy to make good acquisitions to gain scale. For instance, you can see there in Japan now we have 40 operational multifamily assets or PRS as we like to call them, private rented sector, a term we borrow from the U.K. But these are basically rental housing, and our portfolio is pretty newish in Japan.

Average age probably around 3 years plus. So new portfolio also is a good thing because you spend less on repair and maintenance, and they are up to the later specs. So it's been -- not been easy for us to actually accumulate this whole portfolio. So therefore, we put it in transformation because, a, it's the living sector over the last, I would say, 4, 5 years has been a new angle for us. And also the other reason that we put it in transformation is because these assets can then go on to seed a lot of fund management platforms that we would like to do.

So currently, we're warehousing a lot of this on our balance sheet. We've grown it to a total GDV, gross development value, of basically the market value of what would be worth now of around $4 billion. So this is a big portfolio. We have total of 4,564 multifamily units and 2,368 student accommodation beds. So I would say this has been something that we are very proud that we have grown and it's going to make our business more resilient as well as diversify us across our traditional asset classes of residential and office and retail.

And Singapore, of course, we did always have this service apartment, Le Grove. But now we have 3 developments, so-called -- there are 3 projects that are under development. And you can see that each project will also have a substantial, be it serviced residence or co-living component. So that's going to form a nice complement to our whole living sector portfolio. And as mentioned, the other part of transformation is, of course, the fund management. We will continue to push forward on this. We weren't successful in listing our U.K. commercial assets a couple of years ago. Market's a bit choppy. Capital markets weren't favorable then.

But at the right time, we will obviously try again. We believe that belongs better in a public format, which is a REIT. And at the same time, we are also managers for 2 REITs, IREIT, which is our partnership with TKO, one of the bigger U.K. -- Europe fund managers. And so we are a joint manager for IREIT Global. And of course, the very REIT that we listed and sponsored, which is CDL Hospitality Trust, so we continue to actively work on both of these REITs to try to help them propel their growth. And these are platforms that are great for us. I think we can demonstrate our management skills as well as in the future. I mean, we could provide further asset sponsorship to both of these REITs.

And of course, we're looking at the private side as well also. We've been working at it for a while. So hopefully, in due course, we can share some good news. If we're able to do some private equity funds using, what I mentioned before, some of our global living portfolio, I think, to seed some of these funds. And again, I think the reason for going down the fund management route, of course, many of the other developers in Singapore have done a great job on this front. It's because I think we want to have part of our business go more asset light. So we're really managing third-party money here rather than warehousing everything on our balance sheet and the fees, the recurring income from the management fees. And all the good stuff from fund management will really help, I think, to improve our recurring income and strengthen our return on equity, too.

Okay. My last slide before I hand it to Yim Ming. These are our key priorities. We kind of flashed it up at the last analyst briefing. We condensed it a bit more, and so we're just pulling up. Again, I think we aim to have a resilient portfolio, which means that we do need to exercise strong investment discipline, be it locally or overseas. We want to achieve diversification across asset classes and geographies. I think this is important if we had all of our assets concentrated in 1 sector or in 1 country. I think that's actually pretty risky. So I think we've, over the last -- we started this diversification push, if you don't include the hotel since 2010. And I would say, over the last 15 years, we've achieved, I would say, a very decent results outcome when it comes diversification push.

Capital management, as mentioned earlier, we'll continue to accelerate our capital recycling. And we aim to strengthen ROE as well as ensure that we have sustainable and hopefully, growing dividends. And of course, we need to continue to future-proof our business. We harness innovation and AI in various aspects of our company as well as we have to ensure that we are responsible to our planet, so I think -- and to shareholders.

So these are our key priorities, and I will field more questions during Q&A later. May I now pass it over to our CFO, Yim Ming. Thank you.

Thank you, Sherman. Morning, ladies and gentlemen. We'll move on to PBT by segment first. DP segment performed well, and PBT has jumped significantly. Contributors to first half of 2025 include Ransome's Wharf, the office block of Suzhou Hong Leong City Center. Singapore projects such as Myst, Norwood, Union Square Residences, while the previous year contributor were largely from Shenzhen, Tech Park as well as Irwell Residences. Our revenue for this segment increased 24%. PBT increased substantially due to JV projects, Copen Grand, which TOP in April '25, CanningHill Piers, Orie and Tembusu. In line accounting standards for JV, these projects do not contribute to revenue but contribute to profits as the equity accounted for. Hence, you see a huge jump in profits for first half '25 versus '24. So just for information, these projects -- these JV projects will have contributed $1 billion in revenue on a like-for-like basis.

For hotel operations, revenue fell slightly despite a 0.5% increase in RevPAR. The next slide will have more color on RevPAR, but the lower hotel operations is due to foreign exchange impact, particularly for our U.S. hotel operations, which are translated at a lower rate with the depreciation of the USD as well as lower F&B revenues. The group adopted a natural hedging for all its operations geographically. USD has a sharp decline from April following the U.S. tariffs. The U.S. hotel revenues is about 20% -- 28% of total hotel revenues and the lower exchange resulted in a decline. However, as the U.S. operations is overall a marginal loss for first half '25, the FX impact on the bottom line is not material.

So while the P&L FX is not significant, the unrealized FX arising from the balance sheet translation is material. So the hotel operations has a significant foreign exchange loss, which Sherman has mentioned, arising from intercompany loans that we have extended to our U.S. operations for hotel acquisitions and working capital in the past, especially during the COVID years. I just want to remind that this is unrealized FX, it does not affect cash flow and operations, and this position will reverse should the USD appreciates.

So this segment reports a loss of $84 million for first half '25 due to exchange losses as mentioned, financing costs and inflationary cost pressures. However, do also note that hotel operations are seasonal in nature. The first quarter is usually the poorest as we geographically dispersed.

So overall, hotel reports are weaker EBITDA by 19%, hit by weaker performance in the key markets we operate in. In Singapore, RevPAR declined 13.6%, London, a decline of 2%. And for New York, while RevPAR increased marginally, the New York was faced with challenges from various fronts, including the M Social Downtown New York, which had reduced room inventory as it was undergoing renovations as well as inflationary pressures and F&B losses.

Investment properties, fairly stable for revenue. The group has a geographical portfolio of properties. Decline in rentals from the U.K. commercial were offset by Republic Plaza and the renovated City Square Mall as well as [indiscernible] and our Living Sector assets in U.K. and Japan. So as part of our active recycling, the group divested City Industrial Building, Strata units in Fortune Centre, the car park at The Venue and of course, the retail [indiscernible] City Center. So these divestments brought in gains of $97 million, which is lower than last year, which comprised divestment in Strata units in our other industrial portfolios.

So the lower PBT for this segment is due to lower divestment gains and higher net financing costs again due to exchange. Hence, looking at EBITDA as a better indicator. So if you look at the IP segment, excluding divestment gains on a like-for-like basis, EBITDA actually have increased 4%. Other segment revenue increased due to our facilities management arm and higher management fees that we charge our JV projects. And again, the loss is due to flux in FX.

So delving a little deeper into RevPAR by region. So do note that this is on constant currency. So if we move the effects of exchange and these are translated at same rates. Singapore RevPAR dropped 13.6% due to fewer large-scale events such as the famous Taylor Swift concert and the biannual Singapore Airshow, which boosted the previous half year 2024. Decline in RevPAR is in line with mid-tier and high-tier companies -- hotels across Singapore. However, our Singapore hotel was reliant on the shipping segment, which was hit by the global turmoil and affected occupancy for a few of our Singapore hotels. Rest of Asia, RevPAR is boosted by M Social Pocket, which had full operations and offset by our Beijing Hotel, we saw lower demand.

Australasia, RevPAR boosted by acquisition growth for Mayfair Christchurch. For New York, RevPAR increases is due to 2 hotels, which is built more [ LE ] as well as M Social Downtown, which commanded much better rates after -- for the renovated rooms. Over to London. Decline is largely due to Gloucester and Knightsbridge due to rate pressures. Notably, Mayfair performed very well with an 8% increase in RevPAR. Rest of U.K., again, impacted by acquisition growth, which boosted the 2025 performance.

So overall RevPAR, hotel ops increased 0.5% with a slight decline in occupancy, but a 1.7% increase in rate. This is boosted largely by acquisition growth. So excluding the 2 acquisition growth, RevPAR actually have marginally declined a little bit. GOP margin decreased 2.1%, largely due to Singapore, rest of Asia and U.S., contributed by lower revenues compounded by higher costs.

Next, we move on to revenue by segment. Overall revenue, up 8%, largely due to the PD segment, boosted by Ransome's Wharf and HLCC, our Suzhou. The PD segment did well. Hotel operations marginal decline, I mentioned due to FX and lower F&B. IP and the other segments are fairly resilient.

Next, we move on to EBITDA by segment. Growth of 21%, largely due to the property development segment, which increased twofold. Hotel EBITDA is resilient at $94 million, while it's challenging if the cost pressures and macroeconomic conditions, all regions are EBITDA positive, except for U.S., which we bought a marginal EBITDA loss. EBITDA is also largely driven by divestment gains, which led the IP bars to be much higher. The group looks at EBITDA very closely, and we always endeavor $1 billion in EBITDA annually.

Now let's move on to EBITDA -- PBT by segment, declined by 10% to $140 million. So it's impacted by financing costs and depreciation, sounds like broken record. We account for our properties and the cost model and depreciates them vis-a-vis the fair value model. So the decline is largely due to hotel operations reporting a loss. As I've mentioned earlier, the unfavorable exchange dealt a great blow to this segment. So PBT has surged to $152 million. So I didn't calibrate this with Sherman, but I think the emphasis of the results is that CDL is a real estate player across various core segments, across various geographies. So with our diversified portfolio, we're able to weather various challenges.

On the balance sheet, we continue to have strong and robust fundamentals. Cash is $1.8 billion, along with committed credit facilities, $3.5 billion. You might have noticed that it has dropped from FY '24 by $1 billion, and that's because of the amount -- the monies have been expanded to complete our Cincinnati acquisition. Gearing stands at 70% is a marginal increase from 69% in December '24. Average borrowing costs lowered to 4%. We heartened at the latest rate cut by Bank of England, waiting for at least 1 or 2 more. So we will definitely close the year below 4%.

SG rates have declined gradually, the group took the chance to increase our fixed rate portfolio, and now it stands at 43%. We have a balanced debt expiry and debt currency. So for remaining of 2025, we have already made arrangements for refinancing and repayments. We will also look at a window to issue more fixed rate bonds in the next 12 months.

Lastly, for FX risk, so we adopt a natural hedging and do not take speculative position. So this slide shows the FX exposure in the key geographical and you can probably see the U.S. natural hedge is only about 51%. But overall, we still have a strong natural hedge about 77%.

That's all I have. Thank you, everyone. I hand over to Belinda.

Thank you very much, Sherman and Yim Ming for the presentation. We are now moving into the second part of today's briefing, the Q&A. As they have mentioned, some of the key highlights. Today's briefing is primarily on our first half 2025 performance. So I really see a hand out there, Terence from JPMorgan. If you could just address your questions to the panelists, please.

Thank you very much for the opportunity. Congratulations on the set of results. I'm Terence from JPMorgan. I just had 2 questions. Maybe to start off with, want to ask on opportunities for net divestments. Congratulations on the very strong sale of South Beach. And I noticed that this year, the divestments are exceeding the pace of investments. So you're actually seeing positive net divestments. I wanted to understand whether management has a number in mind for net divestments this year. And also potentially, how would you look at addressing gearing?

On my second question, I wanted to ask on potential, maybe rewards -- further rewards for shareholders. I understand that you had a very strong special day for first half. So looking into the second half, given that there are some divestment gains coming in from South Beach, how would you look to perhaps reward shareholders?

Terence, thank you for your kind and encouraging comments. In terms of your first question, we don't -- as I said, it was last year that I kind of early threw out this divestment target of $1 billion. And of course, last year, we didn't meet it. We achieved $600 million. So I do remember at the AGM, someone had asked me, so what's your divestment target for this year. So I was a little bit apprehensive then, but I said, okay, I hope to achieve at least the same level of divestments as last year. Obviously, now with what we've achieved, we far exceeded last year and this year. So we hope to continue to make further divestments throughout the second half this year. Some of the divestments may close in early 2026, but a majority will close -- that you've seen on the screen will close by 2025, almost a bulk of it. And then we may contract a few more new divestments, but those may close in '26. So will be a delayed boost to our gearing then.

In terms of net divestments, and I must -- I'm assuming you're saying divestments but not factoring in, let's say, GLS investments in Singapore, is that correct? Okay. So as I presented earlier this year, right, you can see the full $1.2 billion has actually been into the 3 local GLS tenders. So if you don't include that, then this year, really, our divestment has been -- the net divestment has been the full amount the $1.5 billion. But as I mentioned earlier, it doesn't mean that we will not make any overseas acquisitions as well.

I think we are seeing some good opportunities in overseas markets. And we are very selective and very disciplined about how we do acquisitions, especially overseas when obviously, the risk is a little bit higher when compared to -- on home ground. So we will approach this cautiously, but I still anticipate ending the year with a higher level of divestments than investments even if you factored in the local GLS tenders. So that's one piece of good news. And it won't always be easy to achieve this sort of parity or balance because, as I mentioned, right, the investment amount includes the GLS tenders, which the proceeds, I don't include in the divestment side. But this year, certainly, I think divestments will be a stronger -- a higher bar than the divestment bar that you saw -- sorry, than the investment bar that you saw earlier. So that's one.

In terms of rewards, also, as I alluded to in my presentation earlier, typically, I think for midyear, we will give a special half year dividend. But really I think we want to see where the year ends and with a strong tally of divestments garnered for this year. I do anticipate that this year, when we announced our full year results in February next year, we should be able to announce something that would be very well received by our shareholders. Thank you.

As Yim Ming has reminded me on gearing. Yim Ming, we added last year at about 69%, right, 69%. We had -- obviously, in the so-called short to medium term, we do endeavor to get gearing down to the low 60s or high 50s. This is similar to what I mentioned at the AGM as well. It may take us a bit of time to get there only because we were -- it was very fortuitous that we managed to acquire these -- managed to win these 3 land tenders in Singapore, one of which is awarded the 2 EC sites because it was just so recent, not yet, but likely to be awarded, I would say.

So because of this, our gearing is going to go up, but again, as I mentioned, we have a slew of divestments planned for the second half this year and going into 2026. So hopefully, that will help to offset any potential short-term increase in gearing. But definitely in the medium term, we're moving towards low 60s, maybe even high 50s. But I think we don't want to reduce our gearing to an abnormally lower level also because it's very healthy use, appropriate amount of debt in your operations and investments, right? I mean, that has a more efficient balance sheet. But yes, those are where our near-term targets are.

Okay. Maybe I'll take Brandon first, then I take Joy. So Brandon, can you introduce yourself?

Brandon here from Citi. Just 2 questions, starting with the hotel sector. I think recently, you were saying you guys coming out to say that you intend to triple your hotel exposure globally. Can you sort of explain how we're going to get there? And that approach to going towards more management contracts, does it mean that we could see a faster acceleration in the divestment of your hotels, right? So that's the first question.

The second question would be, would you be open to review again the share buybacks that you sort of did a bit of it last year?

I'll just answer your second question on the share buybacks. Actually, hope I'm allowed to share this info. Actually, our Board has been very receptive. And obviously, when our share price dipped to a low, our Board had approved a significant buyback, but subsequently, the share price started to run up. So there wasn't a lot of opportunity for us to get the buyback started. But absolutely, Brandon, I think we have heard feedback over the years from our shareholders and our investors. And I had another year for that at the AGM as well. So we do know that share buybacks are important, and it's a way, I think, for -- to do some shareholder return as well alongside dividends.

So it's something that we keep in mind. I mean, as I said, the Board has approved the buyback program, but we are just waiting to see when we can start that buyback. Even now, I mean, our share price is still, I would say, hugely undervalued compared to or be it our -- be it, our NAV or RNAV or the second RNAV that I showed earlier. So it's certainly something that we will keep in mind.

As for the hotels, perhaps I can invite our Chairman and Eik Sheng to share more on that. I think it's certainly a personal ambition and dream of our Chairman to be able to continue to grow our hotel portfolio and to strengthen. I think the brands within now stable, be it Millennium or Copthorne or the Biltmore brands, but perhaps I should let the man himself tell you about some of his ambitions and dreams.

Chairman, would you like to address this about this 500 hotel target that you had mentioned during your interviews with the press?

I think for hotel, I've always believed that there are a lot of future because hotel is something that you wait for cash flow to service. At the end of the day, if you want to sell away a hotel and then you can have a lot of capital gain, I believe this is the right strategy. And if this is correct, then I aim to have 500 hotels. That's not too ambitious, I assure you because that can be done easily.

Terence has this question on -- sorry, Brandon, has this question on the management contracts. Will that be one of the new ways that you will...

Maybe I can just add on. So I think we have done, obviously, very well with the owner-operator model, what Chairman explains that we continue to generate earnings from the hotel. And then, of course, we reap capital gains as we have done before with Social Hilton and others like South Beach. So this model, of course, we will continue with this owner-operator model. Ways we can get to 500 hotels, of course, do include management contracts, franchise opportunities. For example, in the Middle East, we currently do have 50 hotels under franchise. And they also have pretty ambitious targets on where they want to grow that to. And there are markets where we're currently not in. So I think what Chairman is sharing about his ambition for 500 hotels, I think this is -- there are many ways we can get to that. I think we will share more details as we develop this.

Okay, thank you. I think we got Joy.

Joy from HSBC. Two questions from me. First of all, on capital deployment. We've seen you doing a lot more land bank replenishment. Will we continue to see that? And in terms of deployment, would you do more DP versus IP? and early on, I think Sherman you alluded to overseas investment. Could you just elaborate a little bit on the opportunities you're seeing overseas? So that's the first question.

And second question on finance cost. I noticed that rate has come down. But actually, overall financing cost is still up year-on-year. Could you sort of guide for the full year, what are we seeing? And also in terms of the refinancing coming up, what are the currencies that you're refinancing in?

Okay. I will take the first question. I think we the last couple of years, I mean, I think we're aside from -- we have continued to replenish I think our GLS sites. So last year, obviously, we acquired this site near great wall that is now going to be launched this year, which is Zyon Grand. So we do, do this land replenishment every year. Obviously, this year, we have been very lucky, as I said, have garnered 3 sites year-to-date. So probably, we will slow down a bit on the GLS for the rest of this year.

I think we don't want to be overburdened with too much land bank as well in any particular location, as I mentioned earlier. I think it's about diversification across asset classes and geographies. And whether it's DP versus IP, obviously, for Singapore, especially, I mean it's -- for us, it's always been a strong DP play for development properties because most of the sites that we go for are usually either pure residential sites or even if they are mixed use, they're still majority residential in nature. Overseas, we continue to focus on our key overseas markets that we had shared earlier over the last couple of years actually. It's been -- always been the U.K., China, Japan and Australia and to a smaller extent, Vietnam. And we continue to push forward on these overseas destinations.

I think we made good ground and depending on which country it is, I think it -- we have a different asset class focus. So like in Japan, you will see that we did have a DP project there, which is the Shirokane site, which we managed to sell at a huge gain. We bought it for JPY 30 billion, and we sold at JPY 50 billion, okay? So there was a nice so-called divestment opportunity, even though we said we didn't develop the site because it was a gorgeous site in Tokyo -- in Central Tokyo.

But that site also gave us a lot of good insights, right, that DP is actually very difficult to do in Japan, especially when you're not Japanese. So therefore, you can see since then, we've actually been only focused on investment properties in Japan. So basically recurring income in nature, which is our whole living sector portfolio. So as mentioned earlier, we have 40 multifamily assets in Japan that are operating very well, high occupancies and rents have been strengthening every year. We also, of course, have 2 hotels in Japan, not including the ones that CDL Hospitality Trust, but we directly own 2 hotels, the 1 in Ginza in Tokyo as well as the one in Osaka, the bespoke Osaka Shinsaibashi.

So I think for Japan, it's going to be more of an IP play. And in the U.K., I think it's a mixture. I mean, we own office buildings in the U.K. And also, we own development properties that we're developing build to rent, which is really developing it into our future multifamily housing. So we do both that there. And then China, right now, I would say it's really only more on the residential sector that we're focused on. China's market still going through some turbulence, but end of last year, we announced, obviously, the acquisition of our big site in a joint venture with a Chenghong partner, Lianfa. We acquired a huge site in Xintiandi area. And that site is majority residential anyway. It's about 77% residential. And so far, projects in Central Shanghai have been doing amazingly well. So fairly strong and irrespective of what's happening in the broader market. So I think we will continue to focus on residential DP in China.

Investment properties, unfortunately, are quite oversupplied in China at the moment. So I think all of you have seen in the news, even some prominent developers and funds have sold office properties even in Shanghai, which is already the strongest and most promising city in China. I mean, I have sold them at big discounts, right, to their acquisition cost, I mean, 40%, 50% discount. So I would say the commercial side of things are pretty oversupplied at the moment that there's no pricing power. So probably not so much for us. So it's still going to be a residential play in China.

So okay, maybe I'll pass it over to Yim Ming to talk about the financing cost.

So I think you're looking at net financing costs on the face of the P&L. So actually, if you delve into the details, we have classified exchange inside net financing costs, which is why the cause a delta. So it looks like net financing cost has actually increased. But actually, if you look into the details, the financing costs, which is just gross interest expenses, it has actually gone down by 6%. So where do we look at full year probably in the same tandem thereabouts, we should be able to still achieve about 6% from previous year. So looking at where we are financing in terms of our loan portfolio. So it's largely for 3. One, of course, is Xintiandi, that there's -- we're looking at the construction financing, and that's looking very, very good. I must say the support that we get from the Chinese banks, way exceeded my expectations in terms of pricing.

And then for Singapore portfolio, there will be the usual for developments, we'll be doing repayment. I am keen to do issue some more fixed rate notes. Hopefully, 7-year money at max of, say, 3%, that will kind of help us in terms of [indiscernible] , help us in terms of fixed rate portfolio and bring down the average interest rate as well. Then, of course, our biggest exposure that's open, so to speak, is our GPP portfolio. We have about 80% that's floating right now. There isn't much of a window for the hedging. So I think we are able to do a wait and see. And then we also want to do that alongside, it is not a flat one-dimensional thing. We also want to look at as we had divestments coming in, what exactly is good to price. But definitely, a window we're looking at not the right time for us to do hedging right now.

Okay. I'm just going to take -- okay, I'll take Rachel and then I'll come back to Dexter and then John, okay.

This is Rachel from [indiscernible]. Just 2 questions. I think firstly, you spoke about the U.K. REIT listing. Just wondering whether you have any time line or is that something that you are looking for before you [indiscernible], like say, U.K. office market recovering or the Singapore. I believe Singapore rate has also come down. There's more IPOs in Singapore. So give us a sense of what you're looking for?

My second question is your dividend. This quarter, we saw special dividend is up, is that an indication moving forward? And secondly, if you talk about a lot more divestments coming through, would you have a policy on how you want to share your gains from divestments in the future?

Okay. I'll take both questions. For the U.K. REIT listing, I realize that every time I mentioned that, the press and the media latches on that quite tightly. I think there is no fixed time line for that because really it's contingent upon capital markets and obviously, interest rates, right, are big determinant of how attractive and how successful REIT listing would be. I'm very pleased to see that U.K. REITs have been -- interest rates have been trending down and with any luck and with a couple of interest rate swaps, I think now we should be able to get our U.K. borrowing for new borrowings of sub-5%, I think going forward, right, Yim Ming, I would say, should be doable. I mean, this is compared to when REITs, whether it's peak, right, in the U.K., I mean, developers are paying 6%, some maybe even more. So I think rates have come down quite a bit already in the U.K. and hope that the Bank of England will continue to surprise us with good news going forward.

So that needs to strengthen itself out first. I mean, it's very hard to do a new REIT listing when the interest rate environment is not favorable. And obviously, investor appetite is something that's very critical as well. So that's why I mentioned the capital markets conditions have to be favorable, too. So we would like to explore this again when situations permit, when the conditions permit. I mean, it's been a couple of years, I think, since we kind of shelved the idea. Back then, of course, the idea was also different. Back then, it was 2 of our assets combined with an asset owned by a third party, a very big asset owned by a third party.

So now obviously, since then, we have acquired St Katharine Docks, this was 2 years ago now, right? St Katharine Docks in March of 2023. So since then now we have a portfolio that's worth at least GBP 1 billion already. So we have the scale to be able to move forward to do a REIT listing on our own. So it really -- but it will be quite a substantial sizable listing. So you really do need conditions to be conducive for such listing. So we're keeping it open. I would love to see it happen earlier than later, but let's see what happens. And again, as the U.K. office sector recovers, I don't have to adamantly stick to having to do a REIT for these properties. If someone comes along makes me irresistible offer, I can't refuse for one or more of the properties. It will be something we would consider. Obviously, our first preference to be able to seed our fund management ambitions, so we can take this further. But yes, we will always remain open flexible to all potential opportunities on the table.

As for dividends, yes, we did do a special half year dividend. And again, as I alluded to earlier, we want to see where the full year lands before we hopefully announce something that would reward our shareholders. I think we've had a track record where -- whenever we've had strong years, we've always tended to reward our shareholders handsomely. We even did a distribution in species, DIS for our CDL Hospitality Trust shares, okay, to shareholders back in 2022, Yim Ming? Yes, and that would have been a big move. These are free shares, okay, we distributed to our shareholders to allow them to enjoy the upside and the recovery in the hospitality sector, of which in 2023 and 2024, we saw strong recovery in hospitality. So that's one of them, yes. So we hope to have more news to share.

Was there any further questions? Divestment policy, we have articulated it. It's not firmly and constant in our policy per se, but we've articulated this every year. Our divestment, we try to maintain a 1/3 divestment policy.

Dividend policy.

Sorry, dividend policy, yes. So we've articulated this over the years, we try to maintain a 1/3 payout ratio for our dividend policy. And what's there? Another question on divestment because you said divestment, which is why I started...

If you're going to have slew of divestments, would you then have a dividend policy on how much you will share the gains of the divestment?

Okay. Okay. Thank you, Rachel. I mean, so it was linked to other 2. I mean, we don't have a specific, as I said, our policy that links also our divestments to our dividends. But yes, I mean, in times when we have a nice bonanza with big divestments, we will try to reward our shareholders more. But on the whole, every year, we try to stick to at least a 1/3 payout ratio.

Okay. Thank you very much. I'm going to move to the front now. Maybe I'll start off with Dexter. Dexter, the mic is on.

First, as a few technical questions. On Newport, obviously, you don't have a date yet. What's holding you back? And obviously, the Singapore market seems to be still doing quite well, but there were some EBS -- sorry, SSD measures introduced recently. Are you guys concerned that more curbs could be potentially coming this year, next year?

And also one more question on your privatization -- sorry, 2 more questions. One is you obviously didn't succeed in your M&C privatization. Would you try again next year after the lockup period ends? And Sherman previously mentioned about working on some U.K. deals with the [indiscernible]. Is there any updates on that?

For Newport, I think we were holding off because we were right about to launch Newport Residences. And then I think it was the week before we launched Newport Residences, they came out with a 60% ABSD on foreigners. So we shelved the launch and basically said we'll take a wait-and-see approach, especially since this is a legacy property of ours, right? It's being -- the whole Newport project is being developed on the former -- the side of the former Fuji Xerox Towers. So we don't have any time pressures here. So we thought we would adopt the wait and see.

And because this is a luxury project, we've really designed very nice units that we -- that will be fitted out to a very high standard level at Newport, and it's really for people who want to embrace that luxury living up high, right? I mean, they're going to have magnificent views of this ocean. So we held back then because of this. But have to say that our recent results have also been in the market, have also been quite encouraging. I mean, as I mentioned earlier, when I was doing my presentation, I mean, we saw that the previous weekend, there were 2 launches within town area, around Great Wall, right?

And typically, as you know, the core central region properties tend to rely on a heavy amount of foreigners to -- who make up a large part of the buying activity, whereas compared to, I think, properties in other segments or in more suburban locations. Those are predominantly almost all Singaporeans, less than 10% foreigners. So -- but those 2 projects actually did well, right? I mean, 1 project sold 88%, the other sold 56%. Prices hovering around 3,000 PSF there around -- their about or slightly more. So they did very well. So that's some encouragement to us. So it's something that we're factoring in to our decision when to launch Newport.

But again, because there's no urgency, I think we just want to wait and see and make sure that the conditions are favorable. It's not a large amount of units. I mean, it's 246, right? Not looking at the sheet right now. So it's 246 units. So therefore, it's not a large amount of units, but these are so-called luxury units in a prime location. So I think we just want to make sure that it's going to have a successful launch. It's always very tough when you're trying to catch the market as a new launch and then you don't have a strong momentum behind you, right? Then it's always you're playing catch-up after that. So I think it's very important to have that launch momentum.

So yes. So that's mainly it. Yim Ming, yes, I also do want to hold the mic too much. Maybe I'll let Mr. Chia also talk about measures, be it SSD or other measures that we have seen in the local market. And you can add your thoughts on Newport, Mr. Chia and any of you disagree, let them know too.

Thanks -- for summary as well. Because it's a freehold project, and there's hardly any freehold project in the CBD. So we don't have time lines. So I think we will have to time it carefully to have a good launch. So we are evaluating now. Anyway, we have spoken to many agents and they are quite encouraged by the recent launches. So it's a good sign that we evaluate and choose the right date to launch.

The recent change in SSD is not too serious. It's actually was the same as some years ago, then they reduced it to 3 years at 4% per year. And recently, they see that the transaction volume because of the sales are quite high. They will reinstate the old policy, but the impact is not much because many of the buyers nowadays are locals and they are buying for investment, long-term investment on occupation. So from the recent launches, you can see that the impacts are minimal. So we are quite encouraged by that.

On the other policies, the new minister seems to be quite friendly towards the suggestion to relook at some of the policy. For example, looking at selling for EC and HDB, which is a good sign and also other things that the developers associate product to him to consider like treat an ABSD, no promise, but I say take a look -- so we are quite encouraged by the new -- I mean, Minister. Thank you.

Yes. Maybe I'll also answer the question on the New Zealand -- the M&C New Zealand privatization, [ Dexter ]. We have privatized the whole -- the M&C. This was in 2019, November already. So this is the New Zealand listed subsidiary which owns the hotels in New Zealand as well as there's a land development division that's part of it. We had tried and we didn't succeed so a bit of a bummer. But it's not the end of the world. I think we did have a favorable result come up from that. Yim Ming, I think we increased by 8%? Is it or less, sorry. Okay. We -- our stake in the listed entity increased. And we are happy at this level. I mean, we put forward the privatization, just because we thought it will be more efficient if the entire M&C was just a private subsidiary rather than having a listed arm for the New Zealand portion and it's costly, as you know, to maintain a listed company as well.

So -- and this portfolio is also aging in New Zealand, so would require a lot of capital. So we just thought that it would helpful if we prioritize it and then we can really start to look at this holistically as part of the global hospitality portfolio and strategy, but didn't succeed and didn't succeed long. I mean, it's okay. So I mean, these things is up to shareholders, right?

So -- but we are now up to -- we increased by 8%. Thank you. So my memory isn't completely failing me. And how -- we are now at 83% -- I mean, 81% -- 85% or thereabouts. So we really own 85% of the company. So it's okay. So sorry, Dexter, not meaning to make light of that situation, but it's what it is and we may or may not try again, hard to say.

I mean -- you had a third question, and it was relating to something about Chairman, but I actually didn't hear it clearly. Because Chairman mentioned that previously -- do you want to make some comments? What was the question?

I think you're asking. Was any progress with the talking to [indiscernible] or investments overseas. I think Chairman has, of course, been in close contact with [indiscernible]. We do not have anything to announce at this point in time. I mean, it's just a cordial relationship. And I think we are just looking for the opportunities to work together.

Okay. Just one last follow-up for me. So obviously, the feud happened in the last half, and you have sort of move on from this. And this is partly the Chairman, Kwek, could I ask after everything that's happened, are you still confident in the succession planning for your company? And do you have a succession time line and confident in the current succession Plans that you have?

Well, Chairman, Dexter has directed a question of you. He's asking, are you still confident in the succession plan and do you have a succession time line, is that correct, Dexter? Okay.

I think first half of 2025 marked a chapter for our group as we overcame internal challenges with tenacity and fortitude. We put past issues behind us, emerging stronger and more unified. The Board and management are aligned and focused on the effective execution and value creation. Our priority is to deliver on our commitments, strengthening our balance sheet, unlocking the potential of our portfolio and deployment capital into a higher yield opportunity. We remain steadfast in building a resilient and future-ready organization, anchored in trust, performance and sustainable growth.

Yes. So I mean, Dexter, we -- aside from in Chairman's personal biography, I mean, we -- usually in the past don't really talk much about succession plans. I think we haven't really talked about that in the last 20 years, nor have we ever given a time line. So I think these things are fluid and ultimately, I mean, will depend on the discussions at that point in time will depend on how shareholders and Board views things. So yes, it's always been the same. For us, it's business as usual as we move forward now. And I think as the Chairman has mentioned, we put the first half, the early part of the first half events behind us.

Maybe -- John, do you have a question, John? Okay, John and [indiscernible] I will have to take the final from Terence, okay. Maybe, John, why don't you...

Question for Chairman, Chairman Kwek Leng Beng. We've seen the share price recover from the April lows. I wonder what's your view on that? Are you satisfied with the recovery? It's obviously been fueled by excitement in the market or potential divestment, what's your mindset in terms of divestments? Is there like a sacred asset that you wouldn't want to let go? Or are you looking at more big-ticket items to sell in the coming months or years?

I think I always look at the bigger issues, and have it done properly. As far as succession plan is concerned, the past has been over. So we move forward to the future with strength tenacity and doing so much or so little. So I'm always looking forward and this should be the case.

Thank you, Chairman, for I think telling it as it is, and we do want to move forward and we look forward, we don't look back. And maybe to address your question, John, although I know it was a directed at Chairman. I mean, yes, we are very encouraged and grateful for the share price recovery. It's not just because of divestments. I think there are other reasons. Interest rates are one of them. As we see interest rates gradually tapering down. I mean that's our big help to our group and to all developers. All developers are very interest rate sensitive, right, because much of what we do is debt funded. So I would say the interest rate environment is one helpful thing.

Obviously, I mean we have to ensure that we execute well on our strategy, be it developing our properties in Singapore or overseas and ensuring that we balance our new investments with the appropriate amount of divestments and unlocking capital gains. So we have continued to do that. So I would say it's twofold. One is the macro environment and one is obviously our execution of our strategy and what we have committed to deliver to our shareholders.

So that was -- I would say that would be what's fueling the share price recovery. Obviously, on top of that, it's the overall market sentiment and momentum.

In terms of divestments, are there any sacred assets? Yes, I would say there probably are. I mean, so off the top of my head, I would say Republic Plaza would be a very sacred asset. I mean, that's an asset where our former Chairman had accumulated the land sites and then our current Chairman had further developed Republic Plaza into the iconic building, the rocket that it is right now. And it's a very important building to us. Valuation of the building would be easily in excess of 2 billion. I mean, and our flagship headquarters as well for the whole CDL.

So it's -- yes, I would say this asset is not something we would consider for divestment or even injection into a fund management platform. But yes, but aside from potentially this and a few other assets, I'm not sure. I mean, I would say we are not sentimental or emotional. I think we look at things as they come by. And at the end of the day, we want to do our best to unlock value for our shareholders. So we will look at everything in an objective manner.

Okay. Good. I know time is running out. I just have two more. So [ Golar ] and then Terence and then I'll just chat back on the media one the last time.

Okay. Thanks, Belinda. Thanks. Yes, congratulations for the results, better than I expected. A question on the divestments because I think Chairman talked about deployment of capital into higher-yielding opportunities. I'm just wondering, since did Yim Ming said 80% of sterling was floating. And so do you plan -- are you looking at divesting [ Teddington and Mortlake ] And there was a building in shortage, but it's not in your presentation. Do you still own it? Okay. So are there any plans to divest those assets? And what are the market values like versus and just generally versus what you paid for about 10 to 12 years ago, if you could on that.

And the other question, I think, I think Chairman sort of half answered it. I was asking, why didn't you consider a REIT with Singapore commercial assets, of which one would have been Republic Plaza? The other one could have been South Beach. Then you have City House and you've also got the City Square Mall and you could have injected Hong Leong Building into it. I mean, you could have done an AEI, and I'm just thinking out loud over there.

I'll take the second question, and then I'll pass it to Yim Ming, you can talk about our divestments for U.K. development sides as well as a development house, which is the property you mentioned in shortage. So yes, I mean, I think what's important when you're listing a REIT is not just what properties you're going to seed it with you're going to -- if you are the sponsor, but more importantly, the pipeline for that, right? As you know, it's not that easy to get a strong pipeline of office properties in Singapore. I mean, we already have some very big REITs, and they have done very well, and they've grown a lot in scale. So I think for us, the list, let's say, a commercial REIT, right, when we ourselves don't have enough office or retail properties on our portfolio.

And as mentioned earlier, some may not be necessarily open for [ CLO ] injection. I mean, it will be very tough because we will have a tough time having a pipeline to follow up, and then we'll be forced to pay very aggressive prices, and it which results in low cap rates, right? I mean, just to get for the properties for the growth of that REIT. So I would say that's part of our thinking. And also, I mean, because we want to unlock value and also to be able to recycle the capital, it was faster for us in the case of South Beach, I think to pursue a straight sale and in this case, in the most tax-efficient manner to our joint venture partner, then to work on doing a REIT, which will take me well into next year before I get anything done. So that's one of the reasons.

Yim Ming, maybe you want to talk about U.K. development properties?

So the reason why the U.K. REITs was floating was not exactly linked, so to speak. But yes, in terms of our development platform, we have about 10 projects, so we have actually finished up 5 of them. The last 1 being [indiscernbile] where we saw as a land bank. So I think you mentioned Teddington. Teddington is currently part of it being leased, years can add on a little bit more. But I think the other question that you mentioned was the pricing today vis-a-vis what we acquired for ignoring financing costs, which is a big element. I think one of the projects for U.K. that there has a valuation we are exceeding what we have bought it for [indiscernible]. Yes, they will have a huge surge. Shortage is actually quite small. We bought shortage at about GBP 39 million. So that's actually not the big ones. Our big one are the two land banks in [indiscernible] as well as in [indiscernible].

[indiscernible], you've got anything to add .

On [indiscernible], I mean, we recently got the appeal through for the planning provision. So I think we have quite a lot of options at our table right now. We can, of course, look for joint venture partners. We could build it out ourselves. And of course, we could also divest it. So I think it really has -- is something we are working on, yes.

Okay. Terence.

Terence again from JPMorgan. Just wanted to maybe follow up from [ Golar's ] question. On the 5 remaining U.K. land bank, could we get an estimate of what's the holding value on the balance sheet? And then given that this probably is not really contributing and it's lower than the cost of financing, would it be better to just divest it? And if we could also get an update on 2 potential developments on the Shanghai’s Xintiandi site, what's the sales strategy there? And could you give us an indication of potential pricing and Delfi Orchard redevelopment? Any updates there?

I'll just do quickly on the U.K. before I hand over to Chairman. I think our current balance sheet value for the U.K. properties is in the range of about [ 850 million ]. This for the entire portfolio, yes. And looking at -- after having planning approval yes, I think it's a good window for us. [ Pavilions ] are very good site, [indiscernible], but I think it's a good window for us to look at potential divestments.

Yes. So Terence, I mean, just to add on to Yim Ming. I mean, we do endeavor, I think, to get those U.K. sites sold, and that will unlock a huge chunk of capital for us. And you're right. I mean, unfortunately, over the last few years, especially, I mean it was a lot of borrowing costs attached to this portfolio, but there was no income coming in.

So for Xintiandi site, we're still in the midst of applying for planning permits, getting our design -- our design is more or less finalized. So we're just applying for the permits. That should happen pretty soon in the next couple of months and then we anticipate starting construction towards the later part of this year, towards the end of this year. So far, if you go and you can independently verify, I mean, how projects they've been launched in Huangpu District, which is where Xintiandi is part of or specifically in the Xintiandi area, it's been very, very strong. Most projects have seen a full sellout on day one, okay? And right now, I would say the prices for -- I'll split it between the 2 types of residential that we have in our side. One is a high-rise residential apartments. The other is villa units, so landed properties. So for high-rise, I would say right now, we've seen the pricing trend to around CNY 200,000 per square meter or more. And for villa units, we are seeing pricing in the market trend towards CNY 300,000 per square meter or more, okay? So when it's time for us to launch and we are targeting to launch hopefully in Q4 of next year, so we hope that by then, the pricing will be even better than what it is today. I mean, of course, I don't have a crystal ball. But so far, a very, very strong in Xintiandi area and in the Huangpu district in general.

Any plans with regards to Delfi Orchard redevelopment?

Mr. Chair, why don't you take this? I've spoken too much.

Okay. It's a very interesting project. And then this -- we are combining the Delfi and Orchard like if at all we go ahead. And so far, we have some preliminary discussion of authorities. They are very supportive. They want to more or less uplift the whole Orchard area, the upper part Orchard area where it's quiet now. But it's a long-term plan. We don't have immediate plans right now, but we are looking at it. And it's a very beautiful site and consultants are very excited. And I think if we were to proceed, we will probably enhance the whole area including our [indiscernible] and other properties nearby.

Okay. I recognize that the time is running up, but I see Sharon's hand. I'm going to just let the media know that there is no doorstop after this, all right? So because the management team has another event to go to. So I just want to highlight. So I'll just pass the time to Sharon.

Are there plans to add one more Board member following Mr. Yeo's Departure?

This is obviously a matter for the nominating and Remuneration Committee to discuss and to propose to the Board. So far, I've not heard anything. So I don't think so.

Okay. Just quickly, if there's any other questions, [indiscernible] could? Okay. All right. Just going around the boardroom again, any of the analysts in the room? Great. We're almost in 1.5 hours since our briefing, but it's been a great opportunity. I just want to ask the panels if you have any final comments. No? Great.

So then on behalf of the management, as you can see, the Board and management are aligned. We are focused on execution and delivering shareholder value. On this note, I just want to say a huge thank you to everybody for being here today, and we look forward to seeing you again, refreshments are outside, and thank you for those that are joining us virtually as well. Thank you, and have a good afternoon, everybody.